Walnut stocks

I'm curious, myself I love the look and feel of a nice walnut stock. But I have noticed I rarely ever see one on a flintlock longrifle. Most that I see are maple or cherry. Was curious if historical they were common or not. I’ve saw a lot of Fowler’s and muskets that were walnut but not rifles.

Thanks, Joe

You’re right, depending on when and where, but in general maple was most commonly used. I could rattle off specific early flintlock rifles stocked in walnut, but it’s a handful.

Generally American guns were maple and European guns were walnut. Of course there are exceptions going both ways.

Cherry and beech were common in the south also and some ash. In England in the seventeenth century maple was known in plain and fine and was about three times the price.

cherry is less likely to crack over the years. beech and maple also but not quite as good as cherry. walnut can crack when the discharge is heavy. ash is good but harder to stain. the reason you dont see oak is the first heavy round and pieces break off of the stock or it splits in half.

English Walnut was a superior stock wood to American Black Walnut.

Perhaps we don't give American Long Rifle Makers credit for deliberately choosing a stock wood (Hard Maple) that was superior to Black Walnut and very close to or perhaps a bit better than true English Walnut?

American Black Walnut was chosen by the U.S. Military due somewhat to the lesser cost over Hard Maple, but probably as or more important, it was much more available in large quantities than Hard Maple.

Gus

BlackHillsBob said:

cherry is less likely to crack over the years. beech and maple also but not quite as good as cherry. walnut can crack when the discharge is heavy. ash is good but harder to stain. the reason you dont see oak is the first heavy round and pieces break off of the stock or it splits in half.

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????
Good hard sugar maple is better than cherry in just about every way. Heavier though.
Anything ash can do, oak can do, instantaneously splitting? Really.
Oak is a bad choice around anything that gets wet or contacts bare metal, and will definitely start corrosion on metal.
Any wood can crack with a heavy (any load really) load if parts aren't properly inletted, but there were a boatload of guns stocked in walnut in the late percussion period that never split, and there are many, many examples of walnut holding up just fine.

Good black walnut is great to work whereas almost any sugar maple is great to work. I’ve never had a properly seasoned piece of hard maple that was splintery or soft or not worthy of carving. But have seen plenty of black walnut best used for “those other guns”.

Hi Alan,
Yes, it was walnut's tendency to crack during recoil that caused British makers to use it for virtually all their guns and especially for their big bore dangerous game rifles. Of course we know the Hawken brothers chose cherry because it was better. Dang, I probably should have made this rifle out of cherry:


dave

rich pierce said:

Good black walnut is great to work whereas almost any sugar maple is great to work. I’ve never had a properly seasoned piece of hard maple that was splintery or soft or not worthy of carving. But have seen plenty of black walnut best used for “those other guns”.

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For many years in the 20th century, the best Black Walnut for stocks came out of Missouri because so many Black Walnut trees there had to somewhat struggle to survive and thus made better wood for stocks. This is why Reinhardt Fajen and Bishop gun stock companies both were in the same town in MO. Black Walnut grown in other places where it is easier to grow, does not result in quite as hard of wood and is the reason there is so much "less desirable" Black Walnut on the market today. One stock set I worked on made of recently harvested Black Walnut was so soft, at first I mistook it for beech. '

I say this as one who grew up with a Grandfather who made Black Walnut and some cherry furniture and was a real whiz at picking out good trees/wood. I have a fair stock of walnut he cut over 75 years ago and it would make GREAT stock wood, but most is not of a size for Long Rifles.

Both Reinhardt Fajen and Bishop gun stock companies went out of business, but their best employee's went to work for Wenig Gun Stocks. If I just had to have a Black Walnut stock for a Long Rifle, I would check with them to see what size blanks they have. http://wenig.com/stocks-blanks/wood-blanks/1-piece-rifle-blanks

Gus

dave_person said:

Hi Alan,
Yes, it was walnut's tendency to crack during recoil that caused British makers to use it for virtually all their guns and especially for their big bore dangerous game rifles. Of course we know the Hawken brothers chose cherry because it was better. Dang, I probably should have made this rifle out of cherry:

dave

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Yeah Dave- I didn't want to mention the British Big Bore stuff because I thought my post might be sounding to caustic/sarcastic, which it wasn't meant to be.

is that alkanet root on that stock? Don't see that much in BP. Always appreciate the pics of the guns you post.

A couple of other points about Black Walnut,

Even when the U.S. Military could get GOOD Black Walnut, they made a point to get straight grain stock wood with little or NO figure in the stocks, when they could. (The only time they deviated from that was during WWII when there was not enough straight Grain Black Walnut to make millions of Rifle and other Weapon stocks.) The reason they chose straight grain Black Walnut stocks for M 1795 Springfield Muskets through the M14, was the straight grain Walnut was less likely to split and crack.

In the 18th century, fine furniture makers also chose hard Maple for their best pieces over Black Walnut or other woods. Part of the reason for that was the ability to carve the furniture, but also because Maple was a stronger wood.

Gee, what's funny here is I LOVE good Black Walnut in general and for some gun stocks, but would never choose it for a period piece outside a Military Gun Stock.

Gus

I have an original long rifle stocked in oak. Yep. Ram-rod too.

Any wood grown in harsh conditions is stronger and will have a better grain look. Walnut, maple and cherry are super but got expensive so beech was used. Then laminated stocks to make use of inferior woods came about. Black walnut was so common long ago that houses and barns were made of it and they still stand but it is now hard to get.

Oak is wonderful but has pores too hard to fill. I made furniture from white oak and stained but just used a rub on finish and love the wood as is without a glass finish. My coffee table is a treasure that I have no pictures of.

Let’s not forget figure and style. The same pretty figure we look for today’s was amplie on display in old guns. Bob gets a rifle, Joe wants one like his ‘with them pretty stipes’. Not long till Dave wants one too and poof, the preferred wood is curly maple.
Americans also wanted to one up Europe while at the same time admiring and imitating what Europe did.
Our first frigates were laughed at by the Brits who called them ‘fir built frigates’. It turned out that American Oak was as tough as good British and much better then poorly seasons oak imported from Poland that the Brits were useing.
Thus American walnut had to be equal to European military gun wood. Then pretty soon as soon as a few were made you could ruin the looks of a company by sticking in a light colored musket in the ranks. Style makes a difference. How many gunbuyies to day buy a military style gun because it looks cool?
I would say the TC Hawken and other such guns could have been made more historical looking by TC et al for about the same money. Evan keeping a shorter then average barrel and blued( blueing was used in the old days). How ever they wanted eye candy. As a thousand ship loads of Greeks about the importance of eye candy.

Have to remember that the old European guns were made of English walnut, not black walnut. They are two entirely different species of wood. English walnut is superior to black walnut for stocks. It is as good as maple. But it is far more expensive.

BlackHillsBob said:

cherry is less likely to crack over the years. beech and maple also but not quite as good as cherry. walnut can crack when the discharge is heavy. ash is good but harder to stain. the reason you dont see oak is the first heavy round and pieces break off of the stock or it splits in half.

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Where do you come up with all this manure all the time? Do you ever listen to yourself?

What got me to thinking about this is, I hope next year to be able to have rifle made with a eye towards future elk hunts out west along with deer here in Kentucky. Perhaps I’ll add dark stained maple back to my list.

Aqua forte put on a plain maple will produce a very dark almost black color. Birchwood Casey makes a walnut stain that very dark. It darkens the curl and it will be visible if there is curl. Not as sharp as aqua forte by IMHO good looking. Don’t overlook shoe polish or leather dye, as these can produce dark stains
Many veggies dyes can produce pleasant colors. Aqua forte was used back in the day, when put on right it’s about the best, but personally I’ve had poor results with it. Other stains were very common in the old days. Laurel mountain makes a nice variety of historic colors.