Pedersoli Bess?

Anyone own a Pedersoli Brown Bess .75 caliber flintlock musket?



Looking for as much feedback as humanly possible before I take the plunge. Have been eyeing one for years. I read and have learned here they aren't the most authentic, but are they well made? I'm afraid a full-blown, 100% historically correct handmade Bess is out of my league. Will a Pedersoli "do" as it were?

-Smokey P.

Mine is an older one, the "carbine" version rather than full length. Can't speak to authenticity, but it's certainly very well made and works very well. One thing to be aware of- apparently the bore diameter has wandered around a bit over the years. Mine is pretty darned close to .750, while many are somewhat smaller.

Would I buy one again? Darned better betcha.

Hi,
If you read through this thread including the respones you will have a pretty complete picture of a Pedersoli Bess. Be sure to click on "View entire thread" at the bottom to see it all.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showpost.php?post/1635987/

dave

I had a carbine once that had some lock work done on it and it was a great shooter. They are very well made and aren't as clunky as the India made Besses. I have one now that is full length.They look good and function well. I think they are good enough for 99% of re-en actors. After all, you just need to please yourself!
Nit Wit

Mine is a reliable gun, greedy with
shot but it will spark with the bluntest is flints I can fit.

B.

In general, Pedersoli firearms quality is good. There have been instances of the case hardening of the frozen face wearing off and spark is gone. The frizzen can be rehardened and restored to full function.

I belong to a unit reenacting a F&I British unit that should have Long Land Pattern King's Muskets. We don't turn away interested participants with a SLP Pedersoli (or Jap or Navy Arms) Bess.

Do be aware that a 0.750" bore Bess will require 11 gauge wads and cards when firing shot or bare ball.

Nit Wit said:

After all, you just need to please yourself!
Nit Wit

Click to expand...

To clarify, if the OP is planning to do reenactments, he must meet the standards set by whichever unit he joins, not just his own. Fortunately, as you mentioned, the Pedersoli bess is accepted by many.

Smokey,
Been shooting flintlocks since the 70s and recently purchased a Pedersoli BB. It is my first smoothbore long gun, and I love it. For a production gun, it is well made, go for it!
Flintlocklar :thumbsup:

Smokey,

The "problems" with the Pedersoli Short Land Pattern (SLP) bess are cosmetic as a rule. The fit and finish should be quite good, and the realiability should be as well. There are occasional "lemons" in any manufacturer's product, be it a Bess or a Ford or whathaveyou, but by and large if you can afford the Pedersoli Bess, and that's what really interests you, then get one. :wink:

IF as suggested you have a group of reenactment people that you wish to join with at an event, ask them if they have any heartburn about the Pedersoli
Bess "fit" with their group. BTW if they have problems,.... again, it will be because of appearance of the gun, not reliability

LD

I can not speak directly to what’s right or wrong with the Bess, but I can say in photos of originals they look like they are much less uniform :idunno:

This is correct, and you have folks who incorrectly identify different Bess today. I just reread the chapter on the SLP Bess in DeWitt Bailey's book, and you have three British goverment variations, PLUS three contracted versions, for a total of 6, and maybe more, or perhaps only 5 in actuality...., part of the problem is written records of requests to make changes that may not have been made, and that no extant examples are know to exist today.

I personally think, from what is written in the book and the corrisponding photography, that the Pedersoli Bess was copied from a Belgian contract SLP, made in Liege. This would explain the SLP lock being different from a British arsenal made lock and having a date of 1762 and marked with a maker's name, instead of "Tower".

LD

It's all very problematic trying to get specific about the " correct" Bess used at any time. When England suddenly found itsel9 at war with either the French or the colonial there was a shortage of authorized pattern muskets. A number of regiments were issued Dutch muskets or Belgian muskets contracted to the land pattern of the time.

What this means and how it pertains to the reenactment unit is up to the unit. It is best in my opinion, for compromises to be made realizing that the Pedersoli Bess matchez the intent, if not the actual issue.
Mike

I'm not reenactor, just a shooter.

Hi,
If you are a shooter, a fowler would be a far better choice than a Bess. The stocks on commercial repro Besses are very straight. I cannot get my cheek down on any of them to shoot well. Certainly someone with no neck could shoot one well but the British army did not design the gun as a marksman weapon and the Pedersoli and Miroku Besses are even straighter than the originals.

dave

The straightness of the stock is ideal with my Pedersoli Bess. When I comfortably mount and cheek the gun it raises the barrel perfect for 50 yard shooting to the point of aim. If I purposely aimed straight down the barrel I'd shoot very low and it would definitely be uncomfortable to shoot. My Pedersoli Bess has been very accurate (for a smoothbore) and windage was dead on accurate with patched .715 balls. I have been really pleased with the gun.

Bob

Because we are all built differently, shot guns especially will fit each of us a little bit differently. What might fit you, may be hard for me to shoot well.

Kansas Jake said:

Because we are all built differently, shot guns especially will fit each of us a little bit differently. What might fit you, may be hard for me to shoot well.

Click to expand...

Very true. I also shoot registered (ATA) trap and you can spend ten thousand dollars on a shotgun and if it doesn't fit you won't break targets at all.

Well I love mine :grin: . After a lot of personal research I do believe that Pedersoli copied their Bess from a 1759 pattern Marine Musket , a very large % of surviving guns have Grice marked locks in the 61&62 range (FYI not seen in US although one is in Battle weapons of the American revolution )Most common Marine Muskets seen in North America are of the earlier 56 pattern ,As for the Pedersoli as they are made in Italy they are made in metric .

Hi 1601phill,
I do not believe that was the case. Artificer could chime in here. Back in the early 1960s or perhaps earlier, Val Forgett (Navy Arms) and Turner Kirkland (Dixie Gun Works) arranged for Pedersoli to make an affordable Brown Bess. They sent over a gun as a prototype and who knows what that was because scholarship concerning Besses was very rudimentary then. Collectors were still talking about 1st, 2nd, and 3rd models in those days ratehr than the correct "patterns". It could even have been a gun cobbled together from different pattern parts. Pedersoli was told to make a "reasonable" copy at an affordable price and no one was really that concerned with historical accuracy.

dave

In Australia the first Fleet 1788 , arrived complete with Marines and their 1759 Marine Muskets . As a very new British out post the most encountered muskets are 59 pattern Marine , India type 1 , all types of Sea Service Muskets , and just about any type of gun trade commercial type you can think of .A std practice of the time was to leave weapons behind for next rotation and to use ships issue for the trip home if needed . At a later time the colony officals gave out muskets to free settlers as part of a starter kit .