Old Musket. Need Help.

I have this old gun I picked up in an antique shop for £100 and I don't know a whole lot about it. What I do know is that it was bought by the previous owner from a load that came back to England after storage in a now closed down armoury in India. I guessed it was used in the Indian Mutiny of 1857-8 and had this guess as it is certainly old enough to have taken part and has something lodged down the barrel that may be a lead ball or something like that.

What I would really like to know is how old it is, where it was made, and generally any information on what this musket actually is. The gun has no markings that I can see apart from a tiny 'G' looking mark on the barrel near the muzzle. The gun measures overall at 57 inches with the octagon-to-round smoothbore barrel measuring at 42.3 inches including the tang. The ramrod is a bit short measuring at 31.3 inches. The bore width is around 16mm wide. The lockplate measures at 6.3 inches long. The lock is a conversion from a flintlock due to comparisons with other locks and how the screw holes and parts are configured. A nipple port has been added to the side where the original breech hole would have been located. Amazingly the mechanism still functions and you can dry fire the musket with no problems. All of the parts are made out of iron: barrel, ramrod, lock, buttplate and trigger guard. The only parts that are not iron are the sidescrew ports on the left side of the gun, the modern barrel band and the strange 'G' shaped mark near the muzzle. The screws are all obviously handmade due to their irregularity and short screw bits at the end. The gun overall looks crudely constructed with bent nails in the trigger area, bent nails in the buttplate and a short ramrod considering the barrel length. I was guessing it was some kind of trade gun due to it's Indian history and crude construction but I just don't know for sure what I have.
I have attached some photos and hope they are good enough. If you have any questions on subjects I have not answered I will try my best to answer. And thanks for any help provided, it really means a lot.

[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]
[/img]

The news is not good :surrender:

I'd guess that someone has tried to turn an old barrel into a two band Sepoy musket.

This is for selling, not for shooting

ah OK. thanks for the info. have you an estimate on how old the barrel or overall piece is?

Come on, someone help me out, small bore long barrel, octagon to round. Beats me :surrender:

Sorry I can’t help but may be you can answer a question for me.
In the 8th picture what is the purpose of the horizontal groove cut into the breach area about an inch ahead of where the tang begins?

The gun appears to be a civilian arm made for hunting. This doesn't mean it didn't see use in the mutiny but I seriously doubt it was used by regular forces.

The period of manufacture is likely after 1850 simply because I do not see any indication that it was ever flint, matchlock or whatever would have been in use before that in India.

The slot at the breach has the appearance of being a slot where a simple, single leaf rear sight was at one time, probably soldered in or a tight sliding fit. If that is what it was, it certainly would have been adequate for the purpose.

I honestly have no idea. maybe its some kind of groove for holding something from the previous mechanism or something like that. but I also spotted a groove on the underside of the barrel which is shallower than this one about 2.2 inches from the tang

thanks. I appreciate the info :thumbsup: though the previous owner also told me it was made in Birmingham as a trade gun or something like that. but as you can see I'm not an expert

If it's truly a Birmingham made gun or even just the barrel and lock, there should be proof marks consisting of a crown over a script BP or a crown over crossed scepters with small letters. The problem is that if they're not stamped deeply, they can be worn down till they're virtually invisible. Look the barrel and lock over very closely and use a light and magnifying glass if necessary. It doesn't appear to be a military issue piece that I recognize but the trade or guns made for India is a remote chance. Good luck.

You are seriously underestimating 1850's Birmingham, I suggest you Google for images of "Sepoy musket".

Indeed, looks like something that came out of the Khyber pass and probably as a Tourist/decorator piece rather than a firing gun. Though it COULD have been fired there by them.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khyber_Pass_Copy

Gus

Agree. No way that's a Birmingham gun. Not even close.

thank you. I'll do that. what do you make out of that 'G' shaped thing at the end of the barrel? its the only really abnormal bit I can see

The 4th Musketeer said:

thank you. I'll do that. what do you make out of that 'G' shaped thing at the end of the barrel? its the only really abnormal bit I can see

Click to expand...

"'G' shaped thing"? Are you referring to the percussion bolster at the breech? If so, it is not abnormal but it is crudely formed, probably effective though and similar to the bolster on British and other firearms made in the 1840s through the 1860s.

thanks but that's not what I meant. you know the picture of the end of the barrel, at the muzzle not the breech? if you see closely there is a tiny 'G' looking thing. its really tiny but its one of few things not magnetic. maybe its brass or something like that but it looks strange

Ah, is this what you mean?



If so, it appears to be the remnants of a stud front sight that has been filed flush with the surface of the barrel.

yes, that's what I meant. that explains quite a bit and answers some questions. but I still have a few inquiries. if the screws are handmade then would they have been sourced from somewhere or is the gun older than thought? and, what do you think something like this is worth? :idunno:

The 4th Musketeer said:

and, what do you think something like this is worth?

Click to expand...

To who? For some, it wouldn't be worth the cost of shipping. IMO

fair enough. I wasn't expecting much after all the news about it. but never mind I was going to keep it anyway. but for arguments sake I was just wondering the value as it sits. not to sell but just as another piece of information I know about it

Value is in the eye of the beholder and hard to determine on line. I think 100 pounds sterling is a bit steep. If I were going to buy it $50. U.S. would be my top dollar.