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Best source for dueling pistols?

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jackc

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I blame Zonie and E. boat for my renewed interest in dueling pistols.

Zonie posted a picture of one he is working on last month and E. boat posted the picture of the pair he bought recently. Both really got me going.

When I first started shooting black powder there was a group in Stillwater, OK that shot almost every Sunday. One of the guys had a matched pair of customn built dueling pistols that he usually brought with him. At first it was just to show off but later we used them for side matches to determine who was going to buy the beer, etc.

A few times we even used them to break ties or settle disputed targets. It was great fun. All I remember about them is that they were smooth bore flinters, either .45 or .50 caliber.

Does anyone make something along this line that is of acceptable quality and something close to affordable? I checked out the Possible Shop and the closest thing they carry is the Le Page smoothbore--but at $895 each are a bit out of my price range. I really would like a matched pair.

If a person could find a nice set, this would make a great heirloom as well.

Thanks, Rocky Point Jack
 
I've thought about this. And I've just about come to the conclusion that what both of us would like probably only a custom maker could build. :m2c:

Cruzatte
 
You guys aren't talking about this are you?
blueing1.jpg


The problem with pistols is although the wood and the barrel are cheaper than a rifles parts to buy, the work to build one is almost as great as building a rifle.
That's why I am afraid any custom gun you want will cost a bunch.

Of course you could build your own. :)
 
Zonie:

I did try building one before. The stock looked like a piece of 2X4 that had beeb attacked by a deranged porcupine. It would fire but it wasn't something I wanted anyone to see. Eventually sold it for parts to another guy who didn't have much more luck than I did. :crackup:
 
I seem to recall from another thread Cherry's was having a sale of some of the Pedersoli's they carry. Might look them up in links. :results:
 
The problem with dueling pistols is that they were gentlemen's (read well-heeled folks) weapons. Even the LePage-type guns out there lack the wood and finish of the originals. Then you need two of them and a mahogany case to put them in so they feel snug and comfy. Such weapons also have a reputation for getting lonely without engraved accoutrements which don't come cheap either. :(
I shoot percussion and flint competition and have LePage in both forms. The guns aquire a "used" look after a while and with some careful cleaning up on the factory engraving and linseed oiling, they end up looking much better than new condition. Pedersoli makes a case that houses them and with some work you can put together the bits and bobs like grease container, hammer etc. without slaughtering the kid's piggybank ::
Best of all you don't have to buy the whole kit at once. You won't end up with a matched set of mantons but for us non-gentleman/fop/rake/bourgeboys with gobs of green; its a compromise that imho is acceptable. :thumbsup:
 
John:

Thanks for your insight. I had considered the Pedersoli alternative and will look into it.

I wonder if they offer a pair in the box? It would seem to me that you might be able to save some cash with a package deal.

Thanks again. Jack
 
Yep. Pedersoli offers single and paired cased sets complete.
Their catalog doesn't have pricing because they only sell to retailers who in turn set their own price. I haven't a clue what they might be going for complete but I'm fairly sure it's well into the "ouch!" zone.
 
I always liked the looks of the Pedersoli Charles Moore. Very classic, but for some reason they don't make kits of the duelers like they do the others. Does anyone make a kit for these?
 
Go to http://www.thegunworks.com

Under the custom and production guns section they have Manton style pistols with 10" barrels, .32-.50 caliber, with flint or caplock L&R locks. Run around $450-500.

Was looking to buy one a while back but other things came up and didn't go through with the purchase. Seems like they might fit your needs nicely though.
 
Just went to the website myself to double check. Seems the only ones they have listed right now have select wood stocks at $550 for percussion and $575 for flint. Not sure how often they resupply or if you can special order a standard grade stock.

By the way they are in the custom pistol section of the web site.
 
Jacob:

Thank you for the suggestion. I looked at the website and the pistols are quite nice but won't work for me as they are rifled.

From what I understand of the "Code Duello" and the writings of the period, proper duelling pistols were to be smoothbore and without a rear sight. Persons chosen as seconds were reminded to make sure their counterpart loaded "smooth and single."

My interpretaton of that is that both pistols were to be smooth bore and that one ball be loaded in each pistol. The website you provided may well turn up just what I'm looking for. I'll keep checking it out.

Thanks, for the idea!
Rocky Point Jack
 
C'mon...push the boat out!! As we say over here...

Treat yourself to a cased set of Hege Manton duellers - absolutely indistinguishable from the originals in every way [after all, I'm not paying].

Seems that you can have one rifled and one smooth, or both, or whatever.

A true replica of a true dueller will cost about the same as they did when they were new - a LOT of money.

A good compromise would be a pair of Moore flinters - plain to look at, as were most duellers, and good shooters, and easy to accessorise...my pal Rob has a set made up like this and they look very fine.

tac :grey:
 
In regards to rifling and sights, duelling pistols covered a large spectrum.
Initially, a smoothbore was the norm. The arms would reflect what was commonplace and would typically lack a rear sight, as would just about all other pistols, duelling or otherwise.
Once pistol duels supplanted sword duelling, things started to change. Duelling pistols were sometimes built as a single arm, and no "twin" ever existed, the "bring your own" thing.
Some sets of duelling pistols were rifled and with both front and rear sights. Some even had ramrods attached to each arm.
Sometimes a cased set of pistols is just that, a cased set. The pair was not intended for duelling. Sometimes an advertised set of "duelling pistols" are not duellers.
When collecting duelling pistols, original intent dictates the title.
The cased set that I displayed on this forum have a rear sight, but are confirmed duellers.
Basically what I am trying to say is, if you make or buy (new) a set, they are duellers because you say so. As long as you hold the accepted criteria. Smoothbore, while not required, will leave no doubt, and probably should be sought.
I will have to force myself to quit yapping, as I could go on forever.
 
Over here in Yoorup, the use of rifling in a duelling pistol was severely frowned on, but there were a few 'cheats'. So-called 'secret' rifling existed, where the first inches of the barrel out of the breech were rifled and then 'smoothed out' into a smooth bore. This was entirely undetectable in the low light that usually prevailed where duels were concerned - dusk or dawn...hence 'pistols at dawn'...

tac :grey:
 
The idea of dueling was essentially you didn't aim. It was supposed to be a quick, non-deliberate snap shot with little thought or intent of accuracy put in. Rifling was not acceptable in England, and generally America, but France allowed it. As did the areas that followed the French pattern, like Louisiana, but then again the sword was preferred over the pistol in those countries far into the percussion period.

That said, tricks like heavy barrels to improve pointability, secret or shallow rifling, saw handles, psuedo sights, etc., were all produced and probably used. Dueling with pistols may have been an acceptable practice, but it was never a legal one. Thus a slow deliberate aim with a rifled pistol would have left a man open to murder charges that a snap shot from a smoothbore may not have. My understanding is that powder charges were also juggled to enhance or reduce the lethality of the encounter depending on the nature of the insult being settled, these matters being decided by the seconds between themselves without the principles knowledge. As was said before, given the short distances (10 30" paces was not uncommon, or 25'), rifled or smoothbore may have made little difference in hitting a man sized target, but had a large impact on the subsequent legal ramifications.

As was said before, a dueling pistol is one made to duel with. My favorite example is a duel with deringers over a dinner table, using cork bullets in place of lead. Not your typical duelers, but authentic all the same.

Joel
 
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