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Leather knee breeches

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This is sort of a comment post. I've made lots of leather pants but never tried to make a pair of leather knee-breeches. I'm pretty sure they existed in the time period but I'm not sure there would be any interest in them.
So give me your thoughts and I might make a pair just as a test run.
 
I'm pretty sure they existed in the time period
What time period?
The deer skin trade of the early to mid 18th century (1700s) was largely about leather knee breaches. They come up very often in period writing, from memoirs to runaway ads.

For many of us they are either cost or talent prohibitive,,,, or both. My understanding is that propper knee breaches are difficult to make even from cloth, and that the method is different for using leather/deer skin,,,,, and even more difficult.

Might be worth noting that while they would seem popular by period texts,,,, most of the mentions of them in the memoirs people here would be interested in, are complaining about them. I'm sure they were great about town, and maybe even one farm or in a workman's shop, but it seems many felt they were pretty miserable once conditions in the woods and fields got adverse. Much the same as the complaints about deerskin Indian leggings.
 
The 18th century would be the time frame I'd be going for. I'm relatively certain I can accomplish making them without much difficulty I've made enough garments for the time frame to be comfortable with attempting it.
I've got some tobacco-colored deerskin that would look good but I'd have to order some pewter buttons to finish the breeches.
 
I make buckskin pants for 225.00 and there would be less leather used in a pair of knee-breeches. With the pants, I make the buttons by hand so the pewter ones would be an additional cost.
I haven't given much thought to a lining like the Lenin use in the wool type, the leather might not need that.
 
I make buckskin pants for 225.00 and there would be less leather used in a pair of knee-breeches. With the pants, I make the buttons by hand so the pewter ones would be an additional cost.
I haven't given much thought to a lining like the Lenin use in the wool type, the leather might not need that.
Again, I could be wrong. My impression is that knee breeches are patterned differently than pants, that it isn't just a matter of making the leg shorter and tapering quicker.
Also, I'm not sure they were commonly lined, maybe occasionally.
Could be wrong. I'm sure someone like @George could provide documentation one way or the other.
 
The cut of knee breeches is entirely different then a pair of buckskin pants, first off they are fall front where as most buckskin pants are not. the pattern is more difficult to do because of the folded seams in the fly and knee area. I include a gusset in the pants I make but they are a little different then the breeches type. At no point did I say that a pair of knee breeches are just short cut pants.
 
2c6d8c72089bd2313dc423ec6f4a97ce.jpg
 
The pattern I have shows a pair very similar to those. The pants shown are very well made but they appear to be machine sewn. the buttons are interesting and I think they are two piece with a leather insert. I have a machine that will do that type of sewing I'd have to decide if it was going to be a juried event or not.
 
At no point did I say that a pair of knee breeches are just short cut pants.
Not saying you said that, or even that you implied it. But, I could see some others thinking that way.
Personally, having both styles of of fly on knee breeches,,,, I vastly prefer the fly front over the drop front. Most, if not all,, of my 18th century activities take place in the woods. With a bunch of other clothing on that essentially buries the waistline of my breeches. Fly front is much easier to deal with when needing to attend quickly to a call of nature that has maybe been put off too long, lol.

I'm looking forward to seeing what you make if you should decide to make a pair. I'm sure they will be excellent.
 
This is sort of a comment post. I've made lots of leather pants but never tried to make a pair of leather knee-breeches. I'm pretty sure they existed in the time period but I'm not sure there would be any interest in them.
So give me your thoughts and I might make a pair just as a test run.
18thc. Oh yes, most proper. Lots of paintings, runaway ads and documentation. They were very common.

Braintan is most comfortable.
German tan, i.e. codfish oil tan or chamois.....is second best but goid.

When you make them, don't make as you would cloth. There should be no seam in the inner leg. The leather needs to be cut as one piece to wrap around the leg. Same as you have to do with breeches or jodhpur for riding, and for the same reason.

Use small buckles at the bottom leg closure instead of buttons..
 
This is sort of a comment post. I've made lots of leather pants but never tried to make a pair of leather knee-breeches. I'm pretty sure they existed in the time period but I'm not sure there would be any interest in them.
So give me your thoughts and I might make a pair just as a test run.
This is a thread worth watching. I'm interested in seeing what you come up with. Keep us posted, please.
 
Years ago I was able to see an original pair of doe hide breeches that were in the collection at Ft. Ligonier in Pennsylvania. They were magnificent. As best I could tell, they were made in the same fashion as linen or wool breeches of the period (maybe late 18th century). I thus tried, not too well unfortunately, to make me a pair or so like them, although the sewing of the originals was better than any hand sewing I have ever seen. Here is my attempt:

IMG_2259.jpg

IMG_2260.jpg


I have worn these for many years, combined with eastern style (mid thigh) leggings, and have found them to be very comfortable and protective in the woods. What must be noted is that 18th century style breeches necessitated a very full seat due to the tight fitting nature of the closure below the knee, be it by buttons alone or buttons with a buckle. When sitting or lifting a leg, the breeches do not "ride up" like trousers or pants and the "rear" of one's body has to go somewhere.

I also made a pair of breeches with the "French Style of Fly", common during the mid-18th century. On these I fashioned pockets in correct manner and used buckles on the knee.

IMG_2257.jpg


IMG_2258.jpg


Also of note is that I Iined both the waist band and the knee bands with linen material as leather stretches a lot and the lining helps the garment keep shape and size.
 
This is a thread worth watching. I'm interested in seeing what you come up with. Keep us posted, please.
Here's the pattern I intend to work with it's the narrow fall style.
The pair of breeches on the right of the picture is made of leather.
I have some inexpensive leather that I'll use on the first attempt
before I go to a higher-quality leather.
 

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Years ago I was able to see an original pair of doe hide breeches that were in the collection at Ft. Ligonier in Pennsylvania. They were magnificent. As best I could tell, they were made in the same fashion as linen or wool breeches of the period (maybe late 18th century). I thus tried, not too well unfortunately, to make me a pair or so like them, although the sewing of the originals was better than any hand sewing I have ever seen. Here is my attempt:

View attachment 93694
View attachment 93695

I have worn these for many years, combined with eastern style (mid thigh) leggings, and have found them to be very comfortable and protective in the woods. What must be noted is that 18th century style breeches necessitated a very full seat due to the tight fitting nature of the closure below the knee, be it by buttons alone or buttons with a buckle. When sitting or lifting a leg, the breeches do not "ride up" like trousers or pants and the "rear" of one's body has to go somewhere.

I also made a pair of breeches with the "French Style of Fly", common during the mid-18th century. On these I fashioned pockets in correct manner and used buckles on the knee.

View attachment 93697

View attachment 93698

Also of note is that I Iined both the waist band and the knee bands with linen material as leather stretches a lot and the lining helps the garment keep shape and size.
Nice. I really like that second pair. Well done.
 
Jay Howlett of the Colonial Williamsburg Saddlers Shop used to offer seminars where students made their own leather breeches from sheepskin. Some seminars were done at CW while others were at different sites. I was all set to go to one of them when I required cataract surgery in my best eye, so I couldn't make it. Not sure when/if he will continue those seminars, at least until the pandemic gets more under control.

Gus
 
Here's the pattern I intend to work with it's the narrow fall style.
Andy:
I have no experience with this pattern or patterns from this company. I have patterns for knee britches from Pegee of Williamsburg, Past Patterns, and Eagle View.
While this warning does not apply to you the one from Peggy Abbott (Pegee) is probably the most difficult to use and definitely not for the Novice or Occasional Sewer. It does have a number of variations, historical notes, and is probably the most historically correct. The second is in the middle and there is some assumption of previous skill in the directions. The third for Eagle View, which is incorrectly labeled "Broad Fall Trousers", is the easiest to make and has the most complete directions. Not sure any of them are still available under these names.

Here are some photo's of leather knee britches from roughly the time of the American War for Independence:
leather pants from Valley Forge..JPG

This particular pair is the simplest of the bunch and are from the Museum at Valley Forge.

buff leather breaches c1780.JPG

Documentation is on photo, This has a "watch" pocket and a gusset in the back not found on the valley forge pair.


leather pants from a private collection 18th Century.JPG

This is simply labeled 18th Century pants in a private collection. They were obviously done by a tailor or someone who could consistently sew the thirty stitches to the inch. The white object on the inside is not lining but foam placed their to hold the shape for photography.

The straps at the bottom of all the examples were for buckles. They were like smaller version of shoe buckles for the same reason. The buckles weren't cheap and one pair would be used on multiple pairs of pants.

The same basic style of knee pants could be found in use in the Mexican Southwest and California as late as the 1850's. These were called Calzones, and were worn, oddly enough, with long white under drawers if possible, other colours if not. White held prestige. Also with botas de ala, garters and zapatones.

Why do I have three narrow fall pant patterns you ask? Well even if you didn't, I am always looking for something a little bit better with Historical correctness, (although I don't think I will ever hit 30 stitches to the inch) and I am, of course,

Mad Michael

references:
Clothing - Male - Breeches & Overalls | PDF | British Museum | Museum

THE SUTTER'S FORT COSTUME MANUAL A Guide to the Clothing Worn in California and the Far West, Circa 1845
Textt and Illustations by David W. Rickman. Published by the Sutter's Fort Interpretive Association, Sacramento, CA. January 1, 1994
 

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The last photo large photo at the bottom is a very well made pair of breeches They are the wide fall type and wouldn't be that much more difficult to make over the narrow type. The only question I would have with those are the buttons seem to be two piece fabric buttons and I don't if they were around in the 18th century.
 
The breeches I made above were constructed by way of patterns provided by these sources:
Brigade of the American Revolution, circa 1972
Barmann, Floyd A., 1980, a Guide to Clothing & Accourterments of Frontier Militia in the American Revolution, Project '80 Committee, Springfield, OH
and this photo of pgs. 9-10, Sketch Book 76, Robert L. Klinger, Reprint 1974, Pioneer Press, Union City, TN
IMG_2285.jpg


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Note: Pattern if enlarged to scales shown will make size 37-38 to fit a man 5’ 6”, 135 to 140 lbs. Other sizes can be made by changing the proportions of the patterns by following the usual tailoring methods.
 
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