Can a stock be sanded too smooth?

[Kilted Cowboy]

Just wondering , can you sand a stock too smooth to where it will affect how AF or stain is absorbed?
Can it be so smooth that it will not penetrate too deeply?
Kibler's videos show him sanding down to the 300's. Does anyone go any finer?

 

[bubba.50]

As long as you don’t close the grain in the process it shouldn’t affect absorption of stain or AF. It’s just kinda unnecessary after a certain point as the finish will smooth it out to as slick as you want to make it.

My opinion and worth what ya paid for it.

 

[BlackHillsBob]

i dont go any smoother than 220. on the finish i use 300, 600 or 2000. then rub rub rub. first with pumice powder and water or oil . where the finish wears through to the wood, respray the final finish at that spot so it is all even and rubbed to a nice sheen. then i go to huts polish and rub many hours to perfectly smooth. if you want to cut back the clear shine, do a little with pumice powder. many dont realize that huts makes the shine very transparent, when you get the perfect transparency the finish almost disappears and just the wood grains shows.

 

[Kilted Cowboy]

Thanks, so going past 220 on the wood sanding overkill.
Put extra into the oil finish.

 

[tenngun]

After sanding with 150, I apply a stain, it’s the only way it seems I can find file scratches or bits of other scratches, or small dives. I sand then with 220 removing the stain and any hidden scratches. Whisker several times till smooth then do my real stain.

 

[Zonie]

Just wondering , can you sand a stock too smooth to where it will affect how AF or stain is absorbed?
Can it be so smooth that it will not penetrate too deeply?
Kibler's videos show him sanding down to the 300's. Does anyone go any finer?

IMO, yes. It is possible to cause problems with staining the wood if you use too fine of a grit of sandpaper.

After you reach a 220 grit size, any further reduction in size will tend to crush the wood fibers down against each other rather than actually removing them. This can close off the surface so it won't absorb the stain.

I know there are a lot of people who want to have the surface "as smooth as a baby's butt" before they begin to stain the wood but really, that's not necessary for the finished stock.
The finishing oils are what actually form the surface of the gun so as long as the finishing oils are properly applied, they will get the finish they want even if they stop at a 180 grit paper for the final sanding.

 

[FerricOxide]

On my rifle I wanted a very smooth shiny finish so I went down to 600 and then hit it with steel wool between coats of tung oil to knock down whiskers with a top coat of buffed wax. On my pistol I just did 220, and finished it with a coat of stain, coats of tung oil and then paste wax. It's much more matte finish vs the rifle and has more grip in the hand .

 

[Vaino]

I only use 220 grit and also use it for whiskering. After the staining is complete,a good rub down w/ 0000 steel wool removes any unabsorbed stain. The stock is very smooth and after vacuuming, the first 2 coats of 2 different products is applied and when dry, 0000 steel wool removes any surface finish. The stock is vacuumed and the 2nd product is applied w/ 2 very sparse coats applied w/ the fingers. The finish is pretty dull, but some sheen can be achieved by rubbing w/ a fluffy towel.......Fred

 

[45man]

I only use 220 grit and also use it for whiskering. After the staining is complete,a good rub down w/ 0000 steel wool removes any unabsorbed stain. The stock is very smooth and after vacuuming, the first 2 coats of 2 different products is applied and when dry, 0000 steel wool removes any surface finish. The stock is vacuumed and the 2nd product is applied w/ 2 very sparse coats applied w/ the fingers. The finish is pretty dull, but some sheen can be achieved by rubbing w/ a fluffy towel.......FredView attachment 8424

PERFECT finish and a job to be proud of.
I do not believe in too fine either. Some got to 1200 grit and the stuff does nothing. Newspaper would be as good.

 

[kansas_volunteer]

Beech can be sanded too smooth. I sanded my Crockett to 400 grit with black wet or dry paper and the chemical I used to give it a old piece of wood stopped soaking In on the third application . It just beaded up on the surface. I cut it back to 220 before staining, and it was still smooth to touch.

I once put a mirror shine on a hatchet by going to 1500 grith. I can't see sanding down to 2000 grit and putting a "mirror finish" on wood. My guess 400 grit is about as far as you need to go. A supper shine on a modern muzzle loader is not HC or PC.

I read once that Amana furnisher is sanded only to 60 grith and then sprayed with lacqure, which fills in the scratches leaving a nice looking finish. I wonder what one might get on a rifle only sanding to 60 before appling finish.

I got a really nice finish on an unfinished NOS beech Lee-Enfield stock sanding only to 220 and finishing with Permalin it has a soft sheen, which is one of the reasons I see for sanding only to 220.

 

[Col. Batguano]

The main thing is about seeing the scratches. If you are intending on using magnification to examine the wood, by all means, go down further. If you're going to use the naked eye, for most folks 220 (or possibly 320) grit is plenty enough.

Most of what you are going to feel however is going to be dictated by the smoothness of the final finish. When it comes to that, feel free to go nuts there. But the smoother the finish generally, the glossier it is, and late 18th century ALR's were typically not finished in the same way late 19th century English guns were (think Purdey, Boss, Holland & Holland here).

 

[tenngun]

I have tr

I only use 220 grit and also use it for whiskering. After the staining is complete,a good rub down w/ 0000 steel wool removes any unabsorbed stain. The stock is very smooth and after vacuuming, the first 2 coats of 2 different products is applied and when dry, 0000 steel wool removes any surface finish. The stock is vacuumed and the 2nd product is applied w/ 2 very sparse coats applied w/ the fingers. The finish is pretty dull, but some sheen can be achieved by rubbing w/ a fluffy towel.......FredView attachment 8424

I’ve tried Aqua forte three times and never got good results. Don’t know if I will ever try it again. But do have a question here I understood that using AF and steel wool were a no no, or is it ok after you’ve set the stain?

 

[Vaino]

I don't use AF ...but if I did , I would stay away from steel wool both before using the AF and possibly just after because there's a chance of incomplete neutralization. One could however use the various grits of Scotchbrite seeing they're non-ferrous.....Fred

 

[Col. Batguano]

Many swear BY AF, and many swear AT it. I would also suggest getting a bottle of Ferric Nitrate crystals to experiment with. A $15 bottle of it from the Science Company will last you a lifetime. They can be dissolved in water or alcohol, but by using water it takes longer for it to evaporate so it gives better penetration. You can more easily control the concentration too. Most guys use a concentration between 4:1 and 6:1. It's essentially the same stuff as AF. But by using the crystals, you'll know exactly what you're putting on there concentration wise, so you can duplicate it more easily.

Another thing to experiment with is your neutralizing agent. Most guys use either household ammonia, or baking soda these days, but back in the day, lye was extremely common. What you use as a neutralizer isn't talked about a lot these days as part of the finishing process, but it IS a part of it.

With this last gun I was pulling my (now rather sparse remaining) hair out after about 20 different concoctions of AF, FN, dye, stain, paint, yadda yadda ---until I read about using lye as a neutralizer. So I decided to try it on one of my test strips (scrap wood from the fore end). I just used a really strong solution of the hardware store stuff (too lazy to boil down wood ash to get it), and it really made a difference in getting the lighter parts of the stripes to jump (thus contrasting with the darker parts) and imbued in a bit of an orangish hue, which was what I was after as well.

After that, (and the lye residue dust being removed) and the over-wash with the next stain was on there, I could rub it all back with steel wool to highlight it further, as the danger of oxidizing the steel wool shards in to black flecks was now (largely) passed, Fred's cautionary note above not withstanding.

A cautionary note about lye though; protect yourself in handling it. In high concentrations it can be every bit as caustic and dangerous to use as concentrated acid, especially around your eyes. If you let it dry on the stock you will get a dusty residue too. That can be brushed off, or, you can just hose down the stock (or take it in to the shower with you to accomplish the same thing while wearing your rubber gloves) shortly after it's on there and has a chance to work.

 

[Sidney Smith]

Both guns I've built previously, I went down to 220 grit and didn't go any finer. I stained, then hit the wiskers as was mentioned, then when satisfied with the results, hand rubbed several coats of Linseed oil on one, and used BC True oil on the other. The True oil had more shine to it, so I took it down with 0000 steel wool. With the linseed oil, I stopped after I obtained the satin like look I had wanted.

I never tried Aqua Fortis, but had thought about using it on the squirrel rifle I'm building now. Do you use heat like Wallace Gusler did to get it to show its color or is there some other way to do it now days?

 

[Adui]

I will qualify this with the following: I do not know gunstock finishing.

Years ago, I made a salad bowl for my grandmother via wood lathe. It was of hardwood. Part of the finishing process of course is to sand to very fine grit. I sanded to 600 as I recall. I also did NOT stain this, as it was meant to be used. Instead I finished it with vegetable oil and polished to a sheen. It was my finest work and was better than anything I have ever seen in a store.

As i said, no stain only oil, and I do not know gunstocks. When i build my first kit it will be following the sage advice of those here because I just don't know that kind of wood. (of course a boiled linseed oil finish might work as good on a polished stock but that's for later experimenting after my first build)

 

[MSW]

I go to 220 or sometimes 320, but I feel that anything more is 'gilding the lily,' so I don't bother... if you have your heart set on using steel wool, please get some with out oil in it - available at fine woodworking websites … the oil can and will wreak havoc on your finish.

one guy's opinion: free and well worth the cost

 

[bang]

Minwax 235.

 

[Gene L]

I would use bronze wool because tiny fragments of wool get trapped in the wood. Steel wool will rust and cause spotting.

 

[bptactical]

Just dip steel wool in acetone a couple times to degrease it.
I wont use steel wool until after whiskering/staining to prevent "freckles".