How to test a laminated steel barrel for soundness

[Dave K]

Your right, I got side tracked didn't I. I will shoot what I feel is a little above my most powerful load, and inspect after each shot. I am checking the stock as much as I am checking the barrels. It is usually the first 8" or so of the barrels anyhow that seem to show signs of distress first. The the stocks can usually be in the wrist are. For prior owners who just love to oil the bejezzas of there guns, the head of the stock gets so oil soaked that everything starts to "fall apart" if not careful. The barrels drives the oil soaked wood behind standing breech back, which turns the tang into a wedge and drives it into the wrist. The oil soaked wood also compresses, turning the locks into wedges and they also like to punish the lock mortises and they split into the wrist. Soon there are cracks and splits everywhere. But, you proved the barrels are ok.

 

[Curt LaManna]

At my shop we do a few checks on the Damascus barrels.
1st we take it a part and check for cracks visually.
Next, "Ring it" tap on it with the plastic end of a screw driver. Listen for 'resonance'.
Then proof it with 2F powder in a moderate load.
Re-inspect it the same way again.
If the customer takes the option of spending more money, we will send it to a local shop that does
Magnetic Particle Testing.
This was only on well made, very good condition barrels of English or Belgian origin.
If you feel the gun is worth the price and the condition is very good. PLEASE, take it to a Qualified Gunsmith to test it properly.
Be safe!
Merry Christmas! :thumbsup:

 

[texcl]

How do you decipher the results of the magnaflux since it is a composite in the first place? Do you just look for abnormally high percentage of particles in one spot?

 

[Curt LaManna]

I really don't know the procedure that well.
I got the shop to say, it looks to be safe.
We only did it on one very expensive English gun. :idunno:
The owner still shoots BP loads in from TOTW.
All the other things can be done by a shop that knows Antique guns.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Twice Boom: Where in my post did you see me claim that what I describe is the ONLY way to proof a barrel, or that YOU MUST DO IT MY WAY????

Sorry, I made no such statements.

You do exactly what you want to do with your guns. That is what personal responsibility and freedom is all about in this country. I just don't want you influencing people into damaging guns by their "proofing methods", and risking injuries that would not have occurred if the gun is shot with both more sensible working loads, and a more sensible PROOF load, without having a chance to get them to think about it and decide WHAT IS BEST FOR THEM.

if you manage to blow up a gun, or hurt yourself, I am sure we will hear about it. And, I am also sure it will be everyone else's fault but your own. :shocked2: :blah: :idunno: :surrender: :hmm:

 

[Joel/Calgary]

How do you decipher the results of the magnaflux since it is a composite in the first place? Do you just look for abnormally high percentage of particles in one spot?

I got lucky, and shoot trap occasionally with an an N-D testing instructor at the local tech school. I was with him when he magnafluxed the "Laminated Steel" barrel of a lightweight Belgian hardware-store-grade single barrel percussion I'd gotten. The magnitude of the "signal" from the welds and the internal structure of the skelp was generally consistent and much lower than the effects of surface dings, breech-plug join, etc. He saw nothing that suggested any internal flaws, but wanted to x-ray it too, just because this (composite gun barrels) was new territory to him, and he'd heard all the warnings about old Damascus barrels. It looked sound on x-ray, as well, but you can really see the differential pitting in the bore following the weld spirals, as, whatever shape this gun was in before it was last shot, it was not cleaned and the bore has been sitting fouled and slowly rusting for decades. BTW, it seems like it was shot with decent powder - no chloride pitting!

Regards,
Joel

 

[texcl]

That's some great info, I'm sure I can have it fluxed here in town for next to nothing. I think I'll proof it first, with a good stout load 10x's with the barrels out, maybe 85 grns of 3f and 1 1/4 oz of shot as that is way heavier than anything I'll be using about a 40% heavier load and I'll stick to 2f for shooting. Looks like I won't have it in time for grouse season but will be able to take some rabbits.

 

[Twice boom]

:bull: Well like I said I did manage to double charge a gun during a Dove shoot and admitted to my lax in concentration . I sure as hell didn’t 't blame that on you or anyone else like you suggested I would..

You have every right to Romanize 150 year old potential killers and I will gladly suggest at every chance I get to always err on the side of safety. I will sleep well at night and you can continue to assume you walk on water. So lets not have anymore of your nonsense..

Twice.

 

[paulvallandigham]

If I had any idea what you are talking about, ( "Romanize 150 year old potential killers") I would comment.

And I don't need you insulting me. I have never suggested that I walk on water, or have any other GOD-like powers. I still put my pants on one leg at a time, and my poop still smells.

I don't think anything to do with safety is ever " NONSENSE". If you don't agree with me, ignore it. Don't come on here and babble at me about things no one can understand.

I have been on this forum long enough that people know i am just plain folk. I hold no illusion of being smarter than anyone. I have made a lot more mistakes than some of these readers, simply because of my age, and the 50 plus years I have been playing with guns of all kinds. That lets me help others avoid some of the mistakes I made, and help them laugh at the ones we have both made.

I have always marked my ramrods so I don't double charge a gun. I have dry-balled many times, but never double-charged a gun. ( With a marked ramrod, you only find out you forgot to put powder down the barrel FIRST, when your rod goes past the mark!, You hope you stop pushing the ball quickly enough to leave some space behind the ball, to put some powder behind it to shoot it out. :redface: :rotf: ) I leave open the possibility that I MIGHT still manage a double charge of powder, IF I don't mark a ramrod, and I don't pay attention to how I load the powder and PRB. :hatsoff:

 

[Twice boom]

Romanticizing? ..

“Personally, I always recommend people treat old guns with respect- the kind of respect YOU HOPE YOU Get when, God Willing, you are the same age as that gun! Use lighter loads in old guns. That means putting in light powder charges, and cutting back on the shot. Using an equal volume of powder and shot, provided we are talking lower powder charges, will let you shoot that old gun for many years. “
The above sounds to me as though you are ready to take the gun to bed with you before you made sure it wont kill you.

Then you said this.

Worry about the condition and life expectancy of the OLD WOOD in the stock, before being so concerned about the barrel's longevity. Be NICE!
to old wood.
In your romantic stupor over lovely old guns and lovely wood you seemed to forget that it wont be the stock that kills you ,it will be the blown barrel/s that’ll poke your eyes out or worse yet make your wife a widow.

And as far as you walking on water, you don’t and I wanted to remind you that we are all human and humans get careless more than few times in their lives. Trouble is you only need to be careless just one time with a clapped out 150 year old gun”¦That’s what I’m babbling about..

And you seemed to have forgotten that this thread was about proving a gun. In case you don't know, proving a gun has nothing to do being respectful to the gun or the beauty of the wood it came with. It has to do with saving your limb and life..
And that’s all I’m going to say on this subject, other than to wish you and yours a Merry Christmas

Twice.

 

[paulvallandigham]

You're entitled to your opinion. I have seen and heard of more people injured by stocks splitting than by having the breeches blow up on them. The injuries tend to be minor, but they are injuries. And, the cost of replacing the ruined stock is a substantial bite in the recreation budget.


Your comments were still inappropriate, and inaccurate.