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50 and 100 yd accuracy

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Road_Clam

32 Cal.
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Oct 21, 2017
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This past weekend I spent Saturday shooting ay 50 yds. My average group size was about 3". I went back on Sunday and wanted to try 100 yds. My accuracy suffered substantially. I shoot at a 23X23 square target with a 9" paper plate with a 7" dia orange sticker as my target. I put 2 out of 11 shots on the paper plate, and the rest were all over the place spanning as much as 15 moa. Shooting my Traditions Pennsylvania is a real challenge with my poor eyes and the very long sight radius. I tried several loads using 70-80-90 gr of powder and the most consistent load seemed to be 70 gr. I'm sure a large part of the poor accuracy is all me, just curious what would should average accuracy with this rifle at 100 yds ?
 
I have recently started using "eye pals" it is just a little stick on circular disk with a small hole in it. You put it on your glasses. It helps your eye to focus. Works like a miracle.

I can see my sights again.

Fleener
 
If you can't see the sights, your groups will suffer.Changing the width and depth of the rear sight can help. Moving the rear sight fore/aft on the barrel can help. Mounting a peep sight back on the tang can help.

Targets are important! I generally like a smallish aiming point. Aim small, miss small. :thumbsup: I prefer a 2" or smaller square, dark aiming point on a lighter colored background.

Once you can see sights and targets, then you can work on loads. 3" at 50 yards sounds like you need to find and examine your patches.
 
bench rest, offhand, sticks, tree and hand,........how are you shooting it?

are you using any system for weighing/measuring each component of your load to ensure consistency?
 
I know the feeling about not being able to see the target. My eyes are so bad now I cant see at 50 yards. With my glasses I can see my front sight but no target, without glasses I cant see my sights.I hate to say it but its come to where I’m going to need some kind of scope or something at 50 yards it’s guessing about were the target is so using open sights anymore is not an option.For hunting it would not be ethical or sportsman like to shoot at an animal without a clear sight of your target.I will keep posting in what I come up with scope ,peep,or something else.Good luck with finding something to help you see better.
 
You can make your own stick on peep for your glasses from a piece of black electrical tape. Punch a small hole in the tape and put it on your glasses. Position the hole so that when you naturally hold the rifle on target, your eye, the hole, the sights and the target are aligned. This pin hole effect will put all in focus. This works best on a bright day. You loose a bit of depth of field as you make a bigger hole. A piece of tape is a lot cheaper than a peep sight or some of the glasses clip on.
 
Like stated your gun should be able to get 2-3" at 100y. Many things effect accuracy and the sights are just one of them. You said 70gr seems to shoot best. Have you tried less like 60 or 65? Look for your fired patches. They usually are about 12-15 feet from where you fire. They should look good enough you could use them again. If you can see a smaller target at 100y I would go with something smaller like maybe a 5" paper plate.
 
I have the same issues. Vision falls off before rifle accuracy does.

Used to was I could hold 1" at 50 yards and keep to 3" at 100 yards. Now I don't even bother putting targets out past 80 yards with iron sights.

Jabbing a fencing staple into my right eye lens a few years back didn't help things much.

Happily with age comes wisdom and patience so I just wait for targets to move in closer or slowly work my way towards them.

But the rangemaster sometimes takes issue.
 
When I bench a rifle for 100 yards I draw a large + with a big magic marker.
The vertical and horizontal are both 1" wide by 12" long on "White paper"
Make your sights more visible if possible. More daylight in the rear by opening the slot to help clarity.
Flintlocklar
 
I went back on Sunday

ML rifles are persnickity things. Doing a test cold on a different day is a different critter altogether. If you get your rifle performing well at 50 yards and are confident of your point of aim, then moving out to 100 yards will tell you a lot about yer shooting and the rifle. Everything is magnified at distance. Tiniest breeze can have big effect. Small errors in hold cause flyers and much more. The long sighting radius is generally helpful to a good sight picture. But placement of the rear sight can be an issue with aging eyes. I suggest you spend more time on the bench at 50 yards, then test by moving the rear sight forward. A friend can help with that. There is an old saying that you can tell the age of the owner of a rifle by where the rear sight is mounted and how many times it has been moved forward.
 
You know ... orange is one of, if not THE worst color for the eyes to focus on whilst shooting!

I prefer a white bull on a dark background for ”˜load development’ myself, but its not an easy option, i.e., you need to make your own. But the black on neutral background works too.

Try this! What ”˜hold’ are you using? I find for BEST groups that the 6 o’clock hold works best. Try it, tune your load, then once satisfied, then aim dead on ...

Report back please, as to what you find works for you!
 
Thanks for all the constructive feedback. Unfortunately im extremely nearsighted, wear very strong prescription glasses and i can just barely see the 7" orange sticker. I have a lot of flintlock shooter deficiecies i need to work on, for now im just veey happy im getting consistient ignitions. Now its just range time . I was just curious what typical round ball accuracy is, and 3 moa @ 100 yds is impressive.
 
Although there are some good offhand shooters that can hit 100 yard targets and get 3 inch groups close to the center, I am of the "lucky to get all balls to score on the target" crowd. That is an improvement from "Lucky to hit the paper" category. For me the 100 yard bull is a fuzzy black dot so any precise aiming is just not going to happen.
 
Ghettogun said:
Although there are some good offhand shooters that can hit 100 yard targets and get 3 inch groups close to the center, I am of the "lucky to get all balls to score on the target" crowd. That is an improvement from "Lucky to hit the paper" category. For me the 100 yard bull is a fuzzy black dot so any precise aiming is just not going to happen.

I shoot high power so I have a good amount of experience shooting offhand. The 33" bbl on my Pennsylvania causes the rifle to be very muzzle heavy. Right now i'm simply shooting off a sandbag. My utmost respect for our expert marksmen forefathers who proficiently shot these rifles !
 
I have just started focusing on the front site and letting the target go "fuzzy". Not as bad as I thought. All my life I have been focusing on target and fighting keeping the sites lined up. Seems to help? I just got contacts and though I can get em in no in less than 45 min's now I seem to be tearing them frequently? Got new glasses though :grin:
 
if you haven't already purchased a copy, I commend Dutch Schoultz' method to your use. it is, to my mind, the best non-gun accessory you can buy.

here's a link: http://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

Mr Schoultz is a very nice fellow and if you follow the method, your groups will shrink - he guarantees it.

the cost of the method will be more than recovered in the savings of ball and powder that you will spend trying to figure it out for yourself.

bottom line: don't be a wus - get help from the Dutch!

good luck with your project, and Make Good Smoke
 
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As we accumulate birthdays, Father Time and Mother Nature gang up on us and make life a little more difficult. I was having difficulty focusing on the front sight when shooting rifles and discovered that wearing safety glasses with magnified lenses helps greatly. I wear 0.5 power for shooting rifles with iron sights and 0.75 power when shooting handguns. The magnifiers help to sharpen the sight picture somewhat. Some people have to go with 1.0 power.


This is a link to the glasses I have been purchasing. They are reasonably priced. I keep an extra pair on my workbench for working on those harder to see items. If the link does not take you directly to the eyeglasses, type reader in the search engine and select full magnifying lens in the lens features section. https://www.safetyglassesusa.com/e...ith-black-frame-and-clear-full-lens-magnifier/
 
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MSW said:
if you haven't already purchased a copy, I commend Dutch Schoultz' method to your use. it is, to my mind, the best non-gun accessory you can buy.

here's a link: http://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

Mr Schoultz is a very nice fellow and if you follow the method, your groups will shrink - he guarantees it.

the cost of the method will be more than recovered in the savings of ball and powder that you will spend trying to figure it out for yourself.

bottom line: don't be a wus - get help from the Dutch!

good luck with your project, and Make Good Smoke

Already purchased Dutch's ebook, great information that helped me get up to speed as I knew nothing about M/L methods. I notice your from SE VT , I occasionally motorcycle travel to Brattleboro , and Hogback Mt are you near either of these areas ?
 
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MSW and Others.
Thank you all for your continued recommendations of my apparently controversial "System".

Most of my happy subscribers are only using the peripheral odds and ends of information.
The stronger recommender ,I believe, are those who bothered enough to explore the central core of my thoughts which are concerned with getting their patching as exactly right as possible. .
In that practice lies getting your rifle to hit exactly where it is aimed when free of your own swaying about,

IF the rifle can't be accurate when shooting bench rest, there is no hope in the world to do better shooting off hand.

All my rifles shot 6 to 8n inch Groups (?) out of the box.. It took about two years of fussing about to bring it down to where It shot 5 shot groups, bench rest on a light windy day that grouped small enough to cover the group with a nickel. .

I learned how to control all the variables except that of wind conditions.

I was amazed at how acute these old style rifles could be made to perform..
I won't be around a whole hell of a lot longer but I hope there are enough folks out there who employ the entire system to keep the sport alive and well long after i'm gone.

Dutch Schoultz
 
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