what do i chose and why?

tdoyka · Sep 19, 2018

i've been sitting here for several weeks trying to decide on what gun do i "want". do i "want a rem rolling block(semi custom) in 40-65 win or a flintlock muzzleloader(semi custom)? well, i made the choice , a flintlock is what i "need".

now i have had a bad stroke, my right arm/leg is basically useless, so i won't be carving a stock anytime soon!!! :rotf: so i'll be building it "in the white".

i have two options, both are basic brass and be left handed,

1. http://www.tennesseevalleymuzzleloading.com/tennessee-rifle

2. http://www.tennesseevalleymuzzleloading.com/southern-rifle

i'm liking the southern rifle, but the tennessee rifle is a close second. i like 50 cal, so i'll stay with it, not to mention i already have a rb mould.

i'll probably go with a octagon barrel. a swamped octagon would be nice, but i'll never handle/need a swamped barrel(remember the stroke).

the stock will be a premium ++ maple and i'll take a lin speed oil to it. https://www.lin-speed.com/linspeed-instructions/ lin speed does wonders with the stock, but i'll have to apply it 20+ times.

basically what i am asking for is what length of barrel(36" or 42" barrel) is needed for hunting deer(50 yards and less is about right, but i'll say 100 yards)?

now all i have to do is save up pennies!!!

excess650 · Sep 19, 2018

The choices are yours.

I have a 42" x 15/16" .50 and its heavy. It hangs nicely for offhand shooting, but I really don't like to drag it through the woods.

The rifles you linked are kind of similar. I like the look of the southern to that of the Tennessee, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

tenngun · Sep 19, 2018

You have to take your health and abilities in mind. Historically thers guns tended to have longer barrels but the only thing that matters is what fits you best.
A 28” .50 won’t make your deer any less dead then a 44”. A longer barrel is a little easier to aim but won’t make your gun in any way more powerful, it won’t add an inch to your range.... well no more then six or eight inches anyway.

Col. Batguano · Sep 19, 2018

Before you settle on a particular style, you might make a more generic list of what sorts of features are most appealing to you, and why. E.g.; hooked or flat buttplate, triangle shaped fore end, straight or curved comb and belly lines, thin or thick wrist, etc. You get the idea

You've already settled the main question; what is the intended use---medium sized big game hunting. up to but not including elk or dangerous game. That (to most) says something 45 cal or larger, but probably a 54 is the upper practical limit.

The other thing we need some direction on is weight. Can you handle a gun more than 8 pounds, and with a more further forward balance point?

We could use some direction on your eyesight too. If it's still pretty good, you can probably handle smaller and lower sights. If it's not so good, then you'll need something a bit higher and more definitive. Of course, you COULD put big obtrusive Hawken-styled sights on a Bucks, but it would always just look somewhat "wrong" if you did that. I actually think that sights are one of the most important parts of a LR. If you can't see them, it's really hard to shoot the gun well.

nuttbush · Sep 19, 2018

I have a TVM S.Mountain rifle on order, it should be ready this Fall. I really like the lines on the S.Mtn. and it's a .50 cal. flint. I almost went percussion. Have you checked the Kibler kits, simply beautiful. I have a Bridger Hawken from a TOTW kit, built by Mr. Bergmann of Tenn. IT"S HEAVY. The TVM's are fine rifles, not quite as light or slim as some of the custom built ones, but I like them just fine for hunting and just shooting.

Rifleman1776 · Sep 20, 2018

Very sad to hear about your health issues. I can relate. But glad to see you are staying in the game. If you plan to build a rifle just for the joy of building, a big contrats. :applause:
But, from what you describe about your right arm, if you want to shoot, maybe consider a single shot pistol build and learn to shoot lefty. Disabilities can be tough but many leave alternatives for the individual. Keep us informed of what you decide to do.

tdoyka · Sep 20, 2018

Rifleman1776 said:
Very sad to hear about your health issues. I can relate. But glad to see you are staying in the game. If you plan to build a rifle just for the joy of building, a big contrats. :applause:
But, from what you describe about your right arm, if you want to shoot, maybe consider a single shot pistol build and learn to shoot lefty. Disabilities can be tough but many leave alternatives for the individual. Keep us informed of what you decide to do.

thats ok, i always was a lefty anyway!!! after i had the stroke, i ordered a [modern cartridge rifle, and] at a 100 yards, it would go 1 1/2 - 2 1/2" groups. using a hoe handle it would go 2 -3" at 100 yards.

but that was then, now i'm happy to do 4" group at 30 yards.

tdoyka · Sep 20, 2018

Col. Batguano said:
Before you settle on a particular style, you might make a more generic list of what sorts of features are most appealing to you, and why. E.g.; hooked or flat buttplate, triangle shaped fore end, straight or curved comb and belly lines, thin or thick wrist, etc. You get the idea

You've already settled the main question; what is the intended use---medium sized big game hunting. up to but not including elk or dangerous game. That (to most) says something 45 cal or larger, but probably a 54 is the upper practical limit.

The other thing we need some direction on is weight. Can you handle a gun more than 8 pounds, and with a more further forward balance point?

We could use some direction on your eyesight too. If it's still pretty good, you can probably handle smaller and lower sights. If it's not so good, then you'll need something a bit higher and more definitive. Of course, you COULD put big obtrusive Hawken-styled sights on a Bucks, but it would always just look somewhat "wrong" if you did that. I actually think that sights are one of the most important parts of a LR. If you can't see them, it's really hard to shoot the gun well.

i actually have good eyes, 20/20. i do like mid weight(8 - 10lbs). i used to own a [several modern cartridge rifles], they both just "nudge".

anyway, i think i'll go with the 36" barrel, for the hunting i do(under 50 yards), the 36" barrel will be more than enuff.

FishDFly · Sep 20, 2018

i actually have good eyes, 20/20. i do like mid weight(8 - 10lbs). i used to own [them modern things] and they both just "nudge".

Have the rules changed on MODERN firearms changed??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Col. Batguano · Sep 21, 2018

Only in ML'ers is a 36" barrel considered short, and a 40 cal considered small.

What you've described is that you are attracted to the slimness of the SMR's and Tennessees, and can handle at least some recoil. Sights aren't a particular problem. You don't mind heavier weight guns up to 10 pounds.

With a barrel length limit of 36" that does limit you though. Within that realm, there are the full stocked Hawkens, and Lehmans, as well as the Ohio styled guns, such as the Vincents (though those are mostly half stocks). Hawkens are generally beefier guns though, so not prone to meet your "generally svelte" criteria. The SMR's and Tennessees you're attracted to are generally not seen with barrel lengths much shorter than 38" however.

Pretty much any caliber greater than 40, and less than 58 would be entirely appropriate with those guns. I would suggest a 50, because that's the most common and easiest to find balls for, but that's entirely subjective. All will do the job.
In the same barrel contour, the larger calibers will produce a lighter gun though.

They also generally have pretty prominant and visible sights too.

One thing you didn't mention was what you intended to shoot (ball or conical). With a conical you'll need a faster twist. With a slower twist you'll need a larger charge to stabilize the ball. Faster twist barrels can stabilize a ball at a lower charge weight than slow twist can. That's something to consider for the range. Not many of us really enjoy plinking targets all day long with full power magnum sized hunting loads.

tdoyka · Sep 21, 2018

Col. Batguano said:
Only in ML'ers is a 36" barrel considered short, and a 40 cal considered small.

What you've described is that you are attracted to the slimness of the SMR's and Tennessees, and can handle at least some recoil. Sights aren't a particular problem. You don't mind heavier weight guns up to 10 pounds.

With a barrel length limit of 36" that does limit you though. Within that realm, there are the full stocked Hawkens, and Lehmans, as well as the Ohio styled guns, such as the Vincents (though those are mostly half stocks). Hawkens are generally beefier guns though, so not prone to meet your "generally svelte" criteria. The SMR's and Tennessees you're attracted to are generally not seen with barrel lengths much shorter than 38" however.

Pretty much any caliber greater than 40, and less than 58 would be entirely appropriate with those guns. I would suggest a 50, because that's the most common and easiest to find balls for, but that's entirely subjective. All will do the job.
In the same barrel contour, the larger calibers will produce a lighter gun though.

They also generally have pretty prominant and visible sights too.

One thing you didn't mention was what you intended to shoot (ball or conical). With a conical you'll need a faster twist. With a slower twist you'll need a larger charge to stabilize the ball. Faster twist barrels can stabilize a ball at a lower charge weight than slow twist can. That's something to consider for the range. Not many of us really enjoy plinking targets all day long with full power magnum sized hunting loads.

i'm going to use patched round balls. i'll start at 50gr of ffg and i hope 70 - 80gr of ffg will be the charge. so it will be 1:66" or so. but i am open to suggestions.

rr11 · Sep 23, 2018

I have a TVM early Virginia rifle in 54, I went with the 36" barrel for hunting in thick cover. I am very happy with TVM's work.

tdoyka · Sep 23, 2018

rr11 said:
I have a TVM early Virginia rifle in 54, I went with the 36" barrel for hunting in thick cover. I am very happy with TVM's work.

thanks!!! i "have" a 100+/-yard shot to my right, in the woods. the left is around 60+/- yards and the front is around 70+/- yards. but the deer come around 40-50 yards and closer to me.

i don't do close cover anymore

. mostly because it(close cover) is out of reach, my polaris utv can't get there

. but i did do it. this was my "last" buck that was shot at a whopping 14 - 15 feet!!!! https://i.imgur.com/FP1RbOG.jpg?1

i've killed deer after my stroke, but this one i'll remember "i will do it!!!"

Ron LaClair · Sep 23, 2018

That's a dandy buck :thumbsup:

tdoyka · Sep 23, 2018

NWTF Longhunter said:
That's a dandy buck :thumbsup:

thanks!!!

Gene L · Sep 23, 2018

Get what you want! You've had a stroke and you deserve whatever you can afford and maybe a little more. I've got a TVM Southern rifle and it's very accurate .36 and a .50 Iron mounted Pennsylvania rifle. I'm an old guy and in ten years, won't miss the expense. So I went all the bells and whistles. So far, I haven't regretted it.

azmntman · Sep 23, 2018

Tdoyka,

thats a respectful buck for anyone, let alone a "handicapped" black powder shooter :hatsoff:

I would be a very happy camper to even see him in my upcoming muzzleloader hunt!

tdoyka · Sep 24, 2018

thanks guys!!!

i shot that 8pt(ruger #1 in 270) while i was "cruising" thru brush and thickets. he was trailing a doe when i shot him high on the shoulder, because that was only thing i'd seen. his body and the chest were obscured with branches,blackberry bushes and i don't know whatesle. there was a spot(like two fists) on the buck's shoulder, so i fired. he jumped straight up and he'd ran. after 15 or 20 minutes later, i busted thru the brush to try a find him. there was no blood were i shot him or the trail he left on. so i followed the trail keeping my eyes on the ground. 20-25 yards later i found him. while dressing out the buck, i found that and entry wound and no exit wound. the 130gr nosler bt
made soup out of his lungs and pieces of heart. i could on find pieces of the bullet. i guess that he was 200lbs+/- dressed. i had a hard time getting him out!!! i wouldn't know what to do now!!!

i have shot "greater" bucks, but only 1 1/2-2 months later i had a stroke. during my recovery, the 8pt and my army basic training never left me. "suck it up, sponge lips!!! you ain't layin' down for me!!! you have a job to do, so DO IT!!!" my sergeant used to say. i spent 2 1/2 months in the hospital and i try to do walking 1 mile(it started out i could go only to my mailbox) a day(do it on back roads).

Critter Getter · Sep 25, 2018

If you go with a straight barrel I would lean towards the 36-38" but if you decide to spend the extra money then by all means, consider going to the 42" swamped barrel. Greg

tdoyka · Sep 26, 2018

thanks!!!

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