Hello all, looking at going with a TVM late lancaster build. From my understanding that would be an 1800-1820 time period. If so what would be the most correct/common caliber size for that rifle/period? TVM offers several. Im trying to decide between .45,.50,and .55. Primary use will be hunting deer and occasional hogs/coyotes.
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Correct caliber for time period?
- Thread starter Jfoster
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Any of the calibers would be suitable for deer or coyote. The 54 is better for hog as they can get large and are tough and the extra whomp of a 54 will make the difference between success and wounding the animal. The extra felt recoil associated with the narrow buttplate of the late Lancaster may make shooting that rifle uncomfortable. An early Lancaster would be a better choice for a 54.
If you are comfortable with your ability to place your shot at a reasonable hunting range of about 50 to 60 yards, then a 50 can be used to take smaller hogs.
Since this is to be your first flint lock, consider the 50.
To be satisfied with flint lock performance, it's all about the lock. Get a Chambers lock or the Chambers' Deluxe Siler lock. The next step is to get a quality barrel, such as a Rice, preferably swamped. Because I'm letting a swamped barrel can be tricky, pay for your supplier to inlet the barrel. Is you go for a straight barrel, think about a 38" long barrel to take away some of the muzzle weight.
Now depending on the tools you have, such as a drillpress, taps and dies for threading bolts, files and carving tools to finish inletting the lock, trigger, trigger guard, and ramrod pipes, it may pay to have the breech plug, underlugs and sights installed.
Extra premium wood is nice, but top performance from the components is what makes the rifle special.
If you are comfortable with your ability to place your shot at a reasonable hunting range of about 50 to 60 yards, then a 50 can be used to take smaller hogs.
Since this is to be your first flint lock, consider the 50.
To be satisfied with flint lock performance, it's all about the lock. Get a Chambers lock or the Chambers' Deluxe Siler lock. The next step is to get a quality barrel, such as a Rice, preferably swamped. Because I'm letting a swamped barrel can be tricky, pay for your supplier to inlet the barrel. Is you go for a straight barrel, think about a 38" long barrel to take away some of the muzzle weight.
Now depending on the tools you have, such as a drillpress, taps and dies for threading bolts, files and carving tools to finish inletting the lock, trigger, trigger guard, and ramrod pipes, it may pay to have the breech plug, underlugs and sights installed.
Extra premium wood is nice, but top performance from the components is what makes the rifle special.
Thanks! Im actually leaning more toward the early lancaster for its wider and flatter butt. I think based on my body that would be best in the end. I was really tore between .45 and .50. Ive only ever had/ shot .50 percusion in the past. Both competitively and hunting. Sounds like .50 may be right up my alley. In the end i really just wanted to make sure a .50 cal lancaster would have actually existed and be historically accurate.
This time lets you go both ways. Late Lancasters were the first commercial plains rifles. So you can go .54, at the same time eastern rifles tended toward smaller calibers, so a .45 is good. Keep in mind that hogs are bears mean tempered little brothers. While .45 is a deer dropper except muleies at long range( 100 yds+ -).
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Any of the calibers you mentioned existed before the AWI and throughout the period of this forum.
I have a difference of opinion than some on a straight sided, 38" long barrel in .45 caliber. I have one on a circa 1790 - 1800 period repro hand built rifle. It is fine for shooting offhand or hunting from a stand, but that barrel is a bit too heavy for a rifle one would move around a lot with during a hunt.
A .50 caliber might take enough weight off that length of a straight sided barrel, though, but I just don't know for sure.
Gus
I have a difference of opinion than some on a straight sided, 38" long barrel in .45 caliber. I have one on a circa 1790 - 1800 period repro hand built rifle. It is fine for shooting offhand or hunting from a stand, but that barrel is a bit too heavy for a rifle one would move around a lot with during a hunt.
A .50 caliber might take enough weight off that length of a straight sided barrel, though, but I just don't know for sure.
Gus
rich pierce
70 Cal.
You can choose anything .42 and larger for a Revolutionary War or post-war era Lancaster rifle based on remaining originals. As mentioned above, calibers were shrinking 1790-1810 to average about .45 (few rifles above .54) but then when the western fur trade opened up, Lancaster “big shop” makers were filling the needs of eastern and western customers, offering very similar guns with wide varieties of calibers from .36 on up. Local guns made by smaller shops were most often .50 and smaller.
Cruzatte
50 Cal.
Intended use trumps most anything else when choosing a muzzle loading rifle. If your primary use is for hunting, check the game laws in your state since there may be a minimum caliber requirement. That said, .50 is a nice caliber and can be counted on to put meat in the pot most any time.
Black Hand
Cannon
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Go with a 54 cal with a swamped barrel. Why get a smaller gun when you can go bigger and get more bang for your buck? A 54 will be lighter to carry and provide more down-range impact force...Grizzly Bar said:
Black Hand said:
Not everyone buys into the 'bigger is better' concept.
The OP did say:
Hogs would be only an occasional target. A .45 will be adequate for all of those animules. And, these days the cost and avalability of lead and bp is a consideration. His choice. A .50 will reduce weight some without producing uncomfortable recoil. Decisions, decisions.
Black Hand
Cannon
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I hunt deer with a 62 caliber. I will never be under-gunned for any large game on this continent. The FACT is that a 54 would have greater impact force, and if you are hunting, this is what does the job.Rifleman1776 said:Black Hand said:
Not everyone buys into the 'bigger is better' concept.
The OP did say:
Hogs would be only an occasional target. A .45 will be adequate for all of those animules. And, these days the cost and avalability of lead and bp is a consideration. His choice. A .50 will reduce weight some without producing uncomfortable recoil. Decisions, decisions.
To go along with your logic, you can kill a deer with a 32 so why not get a 32 instead? You can kill a deer with a sharp stick, so why not forgot the gun altogether...?
The poster is in Arkansas where more 80 lbs deer are seen then 180 lbs deer. I think this should weigh on his thinking. The ml are like tattoos and tater chips, most don’t stop at one.
There is something to be said for the size of game we have here. I have shot and carried out deer over my shoulder that were well within legal limits. We have noticed larger bodied deer over the last several years which has been a plus. The public game lands and private land i hunt has open shots at a max of 100y. If that. Its all very thick hard woods. Most open land is in the bottoms and delta. I live in the mountainous regions close to Mountain View alongside the white river.
Black Hand
Cannon
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The reason for my suggesting a 54 caliber is you mentioned hogs. They are tough animals and I'd go with a heavier bullet with the capacity to create a greater impact. My preference is a quick, humane kill...
hanshi
Cannon
Having killed truckloads of whitetails with a .45 prb in a flintlock and one shot apiece, I've found the .50 and larger don't do anything the .45 can do. I've killed a couple of deer at 100yds, or slightly farther, with a .50 flintlock. My farthest shot on a deer with a .45 was 75 yards.
With this in mind I recommend a .50. I'wouldn't hesitate to shoot hogs with a .45 so just consider the .50 as insurance.
With this in mind I recommend a .50. I'wouldn't hesitate to shoot hogs with a .45 so just consider the .50 as insurance.
...and insurance is ALL expensive until you NEED it :hmm:
This is a much cussed and discussed subject. I'm sure your deer kilt with the .62 cal are much dedder than the ones I have kilt with a .45. :wink:
To answer yer post, a .45 carries enough weight in the projectile to keep it's energy sufficiently high for humane kills out to about 100 yards. I have had to track only one kill and that was for no more than about 75 yards.
I still believe the OP would be well served with whatever he chooses, .45, .50 or .54. The .50 being a middle ground.
Skychief
69 Cal.
The more learned historians here will be of more help with the HC caliber sizes.
I think I can help from a practicality side though. Like hanshi, I've killed enough deer and coyote with a 45 to say they'll do the deed on either. Well, I will add. My 45 kills have been just as quick as my 50 caliber ones. Heavy Indiana bucks included.
Black Hand mentioned the possibility of going to the extreme of using pointy sticks. Many do. Some exclusively. I've killed as many deer with pointy sticks as I have by other means. They work extremely well too. :thumbsup:
Good luck with your choice, Skychief.
I think I can help from a practicality side though. Like hanshi, I've killed enough deer and coyote with a 45 to say they'll do the deed on either. Well, I will add. My 45 kills have been just as quick as my 50 caliber ones. Heavy Indiana bucks included.
Black Hand mentioned the possibility of going to the extreme of using pointy sticks. Many do. Some exclusively. I've killed as many deer with pointy sticks as I have by other means. They work extremely well too. :thumbsup:
Good luck with your choice, Skychief.
Col. Batguano
75 Cal.
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If you are hunting exclusively with a PRB that's a slightly different question than if you intend on using conicals too, which gets us in to the twist rate discussion.
Conicals are more of a product of the percussion era than flint, but when you're hunting it really doesn't matter what you're launching the projectile from. Only what it hits and what it does when it gets there.
Conicals are more of a product of the percussion era than flint, but when you're hunting it really doesn't matter what you're launching the projectile from. Only what it hits and what it does when it gets there.
While I have seen nothing but good, if somewhat conflicting advice here I'd like to point out the OP's actual question. As can be seen above he asked what was the "most correct/common caliber"? The intended use was just added information, but that was the question.Grizzly Bar said:
I only but in because I am curious what the historically correct answer is to that question.
(Well that and I'm a cantankerous old man who wants to be grumpy today.
And before you tell me Im a yungun, I may be by some standards but these days I feel about 3 times my actual age more often than not.)
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