First American Musket

It seems quite late to me but from 'The Engineer' of 1866 I quote:
'The first muskets in America were made in Massachusetts in 1748 by Hugh Orr, a native of Renfrewshire'

Does anyone know more?

Hi,
Hugh Orr must have been a remarkable man. He may have accomplished the first large-scale production of muskets in America by allegedly producing 500 muskets in his shop in Mass beginning in 1748. Supposedly, they were stored in Castle William in Boston Harbor and British troops took them back to England when they left after the French and Indian War (7 Years War). That may have been the first large-scale production of muskets in America but almost certainly other American gunsmiths made muskets on very small scales before then. For example, the Pomeroy family of gunsmiths was active in Mass beginning in the 17th century and several of them armed militia and provincial soldiers during the early 1700s. Apparently, Orr later cast cannons for the Continental Army during our War for Independence, which attests to his remarkable knowledge and skills. Finally, his son, Robert, became a very important armorer at Springfield working during the early years of operation of that government arsenal. He developed standardization methods to create interchangeable parts that were the equal of those developed by Eli Whitney.

dave

Scottish feller at that, probably sailed from the Clyde!

B.

Were these a true military musket? Maybe a copy of the so called first model Bess or were they fusil like. Since it was Massachusetts I would think it an English style stock. But I’m also thinking of the few bayonet used by early Americans armies during the revolution. So I can picture such an American gun made sans bayonet lug. :idunno:

Hi,
I don't think anyone knows but they were adopted by the British troops so they had to meet their specs. Actually, in New England, the likelihood is more French than British. In fact, the British troops during the F&I War adopted captured French muskets to arm many of their troops because the soldiers preferred them as superior in weight and performance.

dave

Hi Tenngun,

Since the P1718, or Pattern of 10,000 British Long Land "Brown Bess" Muskets, the front sight was the Bayonet Lug. That continued throughout all future British Flintlock Muskets of the 18th through early 19th centuries.

All "Regular" British Regiments had been rearmed with P1730 Muskets between 1730 and 1739, though that was the Garrison or "Peace Time" Army strength and did not include the additional muskets needed when the British Army increased in size for War. British Regiments often doubled in strength during War Time.

So when the War of Jenkin's Ear broke out between Britain and Spain in 1739, there was the usual "Urgent" need to provide muskets to arm the increased number of British Soldiers in War Time. However, the winter of 1739-1740 was so bitterly and unusually cold, all the rivers and streams in England that powered the forging trip hammers and grinders were frozen over and barrel and lock production for Musket/Military Arms came to a stand still. What had been an "Urgent" need for additional Military Arms became an "Emergency" in England.

Between 1740 and 1742, England was compelled to buy 15,000 "Dutch" Muskets and 36,000 Dutch Barrels just to arm British Regulars for the War of Jenkin's Ear that morphed into the War of the Austrian Succession of 1744-1748. By the time things improved in England where British Ordnance began making P1742 Long Land Pattern Muskets, all of those Arms had to be reserved for British Regulars fighting on the Continent and in Scotland against the Jacobite Uprising of the "Bonnie Prince Charlie" that ended at Culloden in 1746. So NONE of the then "New" British Ordnance Pattern 1742 Muskets made it to the American Colonies during what was called "King George's War" here in the Colonies between 1744 and 1748. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_George's_War

The Land Forces of the British attack on the French Fortress Louisbourg in 1745 were virtually all British Americans from New England and Nova Scotia. Some British War Ships also supported the attack and taking of the Fortress. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Louisbourg_(1745)

What has been very difficult to almost impossible to find is documentation on the French Small Arms that were captured at Fortress Louisbourg in 1745. There were about 1,400 French Troops who would have been armed with Military Arms and another 900 Militia whose Arms seem to have been unknown. What we don't seem to know is how many Military Arms were in storage there.

When Fort Louisbourg was given back to the French after King George's War, the French restocked it with Military Arms in a large measure. When it was captured again by British and British American Forces, it held 15,000 Military Arms of all sorts. However, that is probably a much larger number of Arms than had been stocked there prior to 1745. Had there been that large of numbers of Arms captured in 1745, Massachusetts probably would not have gone to the expense of having Orr make 500 more muskets.

Gus

Artificer said:

Hi Tenngun,

Since the P1718, or Pattern of 10,000 British Long Land "Brown Bess" Muskets, the front sight was the Bayonet Lug. That continued throughout all future British Flintlock Muskets of the 18th through early 19th centuries.

All "Regular" British Regiments had been rearmed with P1730 Muskets between 1730 and 1739, though that was the Garrison or "Peace Time" Army strength and did not include the additional muskets needed when the British Army increased in size for War. British Regiments often doubled in strength during War Time.

So when the War of Jenkin's Ear broke out between Britain and Spain in 1739, there was the usual "Urgent" need to provide muskets to arm the increased number of British Soldiers in War Time. However, the winter of 1739-1740 was so bitterly and unusually cold, all the rivers and streams in England that powered the forging trip hammers and grinders were frozen over and barrel and lock production for Musket/Military Arms came to a stand still. What had been an "Urgent" need for additional Military Arms became an "Emergency" in England.

Between 1740 and 1742, England was compelled to buy 15,000 "Dutch" Muskets and 36,000 Dutch Barrels just to arm British Regulars for the War of Jenkin's Ear that morphed into the War of the Austrian Succession of 1744-1748. By the time things improved in England where British Ordnance began making P1742 Long Land Pattern Muskets, all of those Arms had to be reserved for British Regulars fighting on the Continent and in Scotland against the Jacobite Uprising of the "Bonnie Prince Charlie" that ended at Culloden in 1746. So NONE of the then "New" British Ordnance Pattern 1742 Muskets made it to the American Colonies during what was called "King George's War" here in the Colonies between 1744 and 1748. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_George's_War

The Land Forces of the British attack on the French Fortress Louisbourg in 1745 were virtually all British Americans from New England and Nova Scotia. Some British War Ships also supported the attack and taking of the Fortress. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Louisbourg_(1745)

What has been very difficult to almost impossible to find is documentation on the French Small Arms that were captured at Fortress Louisbourg in 1745. There were about 1,400 French Troops who would have been armed with Military Arms and another 900 Militia whose Arms seem to have been unknown. What we don't seem to know is how many Military Arms were in storage there.

When Fort Louisbourg was given back to the French after King George's War, the French restocked it with Military Arms in a large measure. When it was captured again by British and British American Forces, it held 15,000 Military Arms of all sorts. However, that is probably a much larger number of Arms than had been stocked there prior to 1745. Had there been that large of numbers of Arms captured in 1745, Massachusetts probably would not have gone to the expense of having Orr make 500 more muskets.

Gus

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That was a good read :hatsoff:

B.

Thank you for the kind words.

Gus

Dave Person said:

Hi,
I don't think anyone knows but they were adopted by the British troops so they had to meet their specs. Actually, in New England, the likelihood is more French than British. In fact, the British troops during the F&I War adopted captured French muskets to arm many of their troops because the soldiers preferred them as superior in weight and performance.


dave

Click to expand...

Hi Dave,

Really enjoyed finding out more about the Orr muskets and especially how the British Regulars took them back to England after the FIW. That is one thing I did not know. That seems to strongly suggest they were paid for with Crown Funds and not Massachusetts Colony Funds?

OK, so I decided to look for evidence where Orr might have seen a Real British Ordnance Pattern 1730 Musket to copy. (I ruled out P1742 Pattern Muskets as none of them came over here until the FIW.)

To my previous knowledge, the only source in the American Colonies for REAL British Ordnance P1730 Long Land Pattern Muskets prior to the FIW, were those given to Governor James Oglethorpe of Georgia in the mid 1730's, along with Naval Cutlasses, because British Ordnance did not have any Infantry Hangers to send at the time. (Oglethorpe was a good friend to the King and that's the only reason he got the brand new Pattern Muskets at the time.) However, that is too far for a local Boston gunsmith to have seen them.

Besides being “The Gateway to New France,” Fortress Louisbourg was also known to New Englanders as a safe haven for French Privateers to raid New England Ships. It also was the supply point/launching point for French Allied Native American attacks on English Fishing Towns/Villages. What I also did not realize until researching the first time British Americans took Fortress Louisbourg in 1745, was how valuable fishing was to New England ships off Newfoundland at the time. It has been said it was almost as valuable as the Fur Trade was to the French.

Then it hit me that there may have been one or two British Regular Regiments somewhere around New England to guard Fishing Ports/Towns and an example of a P1730 to copy? So I began going through the Regular British Regiments to see if I could find one there at the time.

The first one I found was the 29th Regiment of Foot, but they did not get there until October 1745 some months after the New England Troops had taken Fortress Louisbourg and they stayed in the area for a few years. However, there didn’t seem to have been contact with Boston in any significant way. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/29th_(Worcestershire)_Regiment_of_Foot#Nova_Scotia

However, I hit some pay dirt when I got to the 40th Regiment. They had been in the area for quite a few years to protect the fishing industry prior to King George’s War and then I found this:

“At the outbreak of King George's War, the French at Louisbourg immediately engaged in the Raid on Canso in May 1744.[6] A flotilla containing 900 French regulars and militia. The four poorly supplied companies of Phillips' Regiment were forced to surrender. The town was destroyed and the prisoners sent to Louisbourg. Once the regiment's officers and men were paroled in September 1744, the regiment was evacuated to Boston where they provided valuable information on the defences of Louisbourg for the British siege the following year.[5] Governor Shirley was having difficulty raising troops requested by Mascarene and therefore he ordered the ex-Canso garrison to Annapolis Royal.[7]” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/40th_(the_2nd_Somersetshire)_Regiment_of_Foot#Formation

Since the 40th had been a recognized British Regular Regiment for quite some time before that, it seems probable they were re-armed with P1730 Muskets before or during 1739, during the period British Ordnance re-armed the entire British Army. If that was true, then their captured arms would almost certainly have been stored at Fort Loiuisbourg before the New England forces took it in 1745. I’m sure the New England forces brought back every kind of gun the French had in storage and especially any British Military Arms. So this is a possible scenario for how a Boston Gunsmith could have closely seen/inspected the latest British Military Musket in the Colonies.

Now please understand the above is speculation on my part and I agree it is just as possible Orr made his Muskets based on the French Muskets captured at Fort Louisbourg. But IMO it seems likely, if not probable to me that Orr would have been expected to make copies of British Muskets.

Of course English “Para Military” Muskets, made by some of the same English Contractors who made the parts for the British P1730 Muskets, could also have come to Boston prior to 1748.

Nothing I found provides anything more than possibilities for the Muskets Orr made. Perhaps someday one of the Orr Muskets will be found and identified?

Gus

Hi Gus,
That is a great discussion and certainly is plausible. However, Orr apparently was trained as a gunsmith in Renfrewshire, Scotland before he migrated to MA near Plymouth in 1740. He was 21 when he immigrated and a fully trained gun and locksmith. He could easily have examined British ordnance muskets.

dave

My thoughts exactly Dave, As a time served gunsmith apprentice he was very likely used to working on service muskets and would be able to reproduce what he knew.

21 is typically when an apprentice had served his 7 years training and qualified as a journeyman. Moving to the English colonies would let him set up a shop of his own without needing to work in a Master's shop and qualify as a Master. He would have been able to do all the works needed on wood and metal to carry out the task and would know the key dimensions for a pattern weapon.

Ironically he may have made ones to the last pattern if that was what he had learned by working on them and possibly more modern than the usual service patterns on issue in America.

BTW to the uninformed: a simple Google on 'Hugh Orr gunsmith' will lead you to much biographical information on him and his work.

Raedwald said:

He would have been able to do all the works needed on wood and metal to carry out the task and would know the key dimensions for a pattern weapon.

Ironically he may have made ones to the last pattern if that was what he had learned by working on them and possibly more modern than the usual service patterns on issue in America.

Click to expand...

I write this with sincere respect, but how do we know the underlined section above is true?

The Royal Scots Fusiliers were on Garrison Duty in the Scottish lowlands at this time, and thus would have been rearmed with "The Newest Pattern" P1730 Muskets sometime in the 1730's before Orr left Scotland. So it is possible Orr could have seen one of the newest pattern Muskets.

However, was there a Garrison of the Scots Fusiliers close enough to the shop where Orr was apprenticed? (I could not find one, but that doesn't mean there wasn't one.) If there wasn't a Garrison of Fusiliers close by, then the chances of repair work on the newest pattern musket would have been very slim at best and quite possibly nonexistent.

Gus

BTW, also checked the Scots Grays, who were in Garrison in Scotland at the time as well. Though they were Dragoons, they MAY have been issued some or all P1730 Long Land Pattern Muskets as well.

Hi Gus,
Good points but we don't know where Orr apprenticed. I looked at my Scottish sources and there were at least 5 gunmakers in Glasgow and Dumbarton, towns near where Orr grew up. Interestingly, one of those was Patrick Buchanan who I may be related to. But he may have gone further away for training. We just don't know. One thing we do know is that British troops, particularly light infantry and scouts, appreciated French muskets during the F&I war. We don't know how far back that appreciation goes and if British troops would value muskets of French design in 1748. Anyway, Orr made muskets that British troops in America accepted so that says something about their design. Whether British or French in design, perhaps we can never know.

dave

Thanks Dave,

I guess I assumed Hugh had apprenticed in a shop nearer his home.

Had he apprenticed in Glasgow, then the chances of seeing or doing repair work on a New Pattern Musket would have been much better as some units of both the Fusiliers and Grays were known to have come there from time to time. Not sure, but I think some of the Fusiliers were stationed in Glasgow as well.

Yes, some of the British Light Infantry equipped with Carbines in the FIW, turned their Carbines back in and got LLP Muskets, as they felt the Carbines were not robust enough for that service.

Later when in 1758 they took Fortress Louisbourg for the second time, the French Muskets proved very popular with the Light Infantry, Rangers and I'm sure many of the British American Militia.

I cannot document this, but I personally think any British American Militia Man who had participated in the capture of the Fortress in 1758, would have been given a French Musket, the Bayonet fit to it and possibly the rest of a "Stand of Arms" that he wanted.

Further, there were American made or restocked fowlers made in New England in the 1730's with buttstocks resembling French Guns. So it is possible the Orr Muskets could have been copied from French Muskets, as the general style would not have been completely alien to them.

However, I still think the Orr Muskets would have more closely resembled British Military Arms, being a British Colony and most likely wishing to look as "Properly Military," meaning similar to British Arms, rather than those of "the Enemy." Of course I could be completely mistaken if an Orr musket is ever found and identified.

Gus