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Login Name Post: kentucky rifle        (Topic#305634)
vgorilla 
32 Cal.
Posts: 8
12-05-17 05:11 PM - Post#1655283    


Traditions kentucky rifle. School me the good the bad fit finish accuracy ,thanks.


 
azmntman 
75 Cal.
Posts: 5700
azmntman
12-05-17 05:30 PM - Post#1655288    

    In response to vgorilla

Entry level gun. Kits are easy to assemble. Factory made the fit can be from flawless to "OMG, they let that out?". Kits are up to you on care and patience building. Finish, again from nice to WTH? Stocks were and are not premium wood so you do the best ya can with what they send ya if you build one. They certianly can be made to look good.

Reliable enough in cap lock, some flinters had poor locks that were not good sparkers. Accuracy was very good for the money.

I like em, have had two. Wish I had one of them back! If ya cant get a custom or semi custom great way to get into the sport. On a Traditions I recommend a caplock to start

 
Colorado Clyde 
Cannon
Posts: 15106
Colorado Clyde
12-05-17 05:37 PM - Post#1655289    

    In response to vgorilla

Inexpensive, solid, and accurate.
There are lots of videos on Youtube....Just remember that their experience levels and proficiency levels vary....


 
Smokey Plainsman 
45 Cal.
Posts: 983
Smokey Plainsman
12-05-17 07:34 PM - Post#1655319    

    In response to Colorado Clyde

Their Kentucky has a hideous two piece stock with a big brass seam running down it. I have never, ever seen such a thing on a period rifle, and it sticks out like a sore thumb.

 
Colorado Clyde 
Cannon
Posts: 15106
Colorado Clyde
12-05-17 08:47 PM - Post#1655344    

    In response to Smokey Plainsman

  • Smokey Plainsman Said:
Their Kentucky has a hideous two piece stock with a big brass seam running down it. I have never, ever seen such a thing on a period rifle, and it sticks out like a sore thumb.


For $500.00+ dollars less than the next competitor....I can tolerate the 2 piece stock. One just has to accept is for what it is...At least the sights and stock aren't plastic.


 
Zonie 
Moderator
Posts: 26661
Zonie
12-05-17 10:21 PM - Post#1655363    

    In response to Smokey Plainsman

  • Smokey Plainsman Said:
Their Kentucky has a hideous two piece stock with a big brass seam running down it. I have never, ever seen such a thing on a period rifle, and it sticks out like a sore thumb.


I'm not saying I like a rifle with a brass strip between the wooden full length for-end and the stock but, have you seen the picture shown on page 115 in Charles E. Hanson Jr.'s book, THE PLAINS RIFLE ?

It shows a fairly short plains rifle with a very similar brass strip separating the wooden for-end and the main stock and is located just in front of the ramrod entry pipe.
The rifle has a back-action percussion lock

Some, including the author say the rifle is "Old Sally". A rifle owned by Joe Meek, noted Mountain Man who trapped with the likes of Jim Bridger.

On page 136 the book gives an account of Old Sally saying Meek preferred it to a Hawken which he thought was too heavy. The book goes on to quoting Joe Meek and his account of the gun being taken by a Crow Chief.

The text goes on to say,
" "Old Sally is shown in Plate 51. The historic weapon is now owned by the Oregon Historical Society. On the right side of the stock "J. Meek, Rocky Mountains" is crudely carved. On the left side are the words "Death" and "A. Kelly" and a running deer."

I mention this because the rifle indicates that guns having a brass plate between the main stock and the for-end do exist.
Just Jim...



 
Colorado Clyde 
Cannon
Posts: 15106
Colorado Clyde
12-05-17 10:37 PM - Post#1655367    

    In response to Zonie

.....


 
necchi 
Cannon
Posts: 12474
necchi
12-06-17 07:28 PM - Post#1655514    

    In response to Colorado Clyde

  • Colorado Clyde Said:
Inexpensive, solid, and accurate.


The olde Jukar and CVA split stock Kentucky's with the slow twist barrel could/can be tuned to be very accurate rifles,, the locks lacked finish as well as the triggers, but again with a little effort they could/can be brought to a good operating condition and make fine shooters to this day.
I have not seen the Traditions Kentucky with 1/48 twist represent itself as a rifle worth considering for any even Rendezvous competition shooting as yet.
They may make a decent hunter and an entry level gun for fun shooting or plinking.
If you can pick one up for a good price go for it,, I don't think I'd buy one new.
JohnT
Molon Labe~


 
tenngun 
Cannon
Posts: 7913
tenngun
12-06-17 08:34 PM - Post#1655518    

    In response to Zonie

One can always make a ‘field repair’ cover the brass joint with rawhide shrunk on or with a copper/brass wire wrap as this was common repair in days gone by. The maple has no figure and can be stained very dark, making it almost impossible to tell it’s not one piece of wood.

 
Phil Coffins 
40 Cal.
Posts: 132
Phil Coffins
12-07-17 05:02 PM - Post#1655709    

    In response to vgorilla

This is a bottom of the barrel muzzle loader. It can be serviceable but there are better guns to allow a first time shooter to enjoy the sport rather then sort threw the short coming of a "cheap way to try it".
Disregard the looks and consider the lock has no bridle, the ram rod is thin, trigger is crude and sights are poorly made.
I have bought these at garage sales for as low as $25 and spent too much time on them to dress them up for wall hangers. Yes, they did shoot but mostly they were just to dress up the mantle place.

 
Wes/Tex 
Cannon
Posts: 7787
Wes/Tex
12-07-17 05:26 PM - Post#1655712    

    In response to Phil Coffins

From now what you say is true but some of us older farts remember some real 'bottom of the barrel' stuff that came in even prior to CVA's start up...which is to say, crap varies! What makes me smile is how CVA's production ran through periods of better and worse. The older Kentuckys with the wide band between stock halves were better done than the later with the brass insert...for whatever that's worth. 35 years ago, there were far fewer options out there and many of our current older shooters cut their teeth on them. One of my pals still has his and it still shoots well. Pretty? Hardly, but it's like a child to him. The word 'hideous' was used farther up the page and that's probably true. But, were I to look for one now I'd certainly hunt for one of the older ones with the big, wide brass joint cover. Chalk it up to memories!

 
54ball 
62 Cal.
Posts: 2632
54ball
12-07-17 05:45 PM - Post#1655716    

    In response to Phil Coffins

I have seen junk...real stinkers some costing quite a lot of money. The old CVA Kentucky is not one of these.

One thing to consider is this has been a popular kit gun for over 40 years. Thousands of these were put together by the unskilled.
So a cheap gun put together by the unskilled or by those who really do not care tends to be abused.and neglected. Anything that's neglected will eventually perform poorly.

This design has proven itself to be a solid and reliable shooter especially in percussion.

I have seen few that were absolutely spectacular with patch boxes, cheek piece, fore stock molding, engraving and even carved. So the sky is really the limit on what you can do with these.

 
Zonie 
Moderator
Posts: 26661
Zonie
12-07-17 07:13 PM - Post#1655726    

    In response to Phil Coffins

Speaking of "bridle", CVA's lock originally came without one.

Their later guns locks were changed to incorporate one and the current importer of basically the same gun, Traditions, still is using a bridled lock.

In case vgorilla doesn't know what a bridle is, I'll try to explain it.

A bridle is like a bridge that extends over a movable part.
It has a hole thru it and the movable part has a pin or axle on it which goes thru the bridles hole.
Having a bridle therefore, provides a great deal of support to the rotating part.

Inside the lock is a "tumbler" which the mainspring pushes against to rotate it.
It has a short shaft that goes thru a hole in the lockplate. The hammer is attached to the outer end of this shaft or axle.

The tumbler also has two notches cut across it to hold it in the half cock position or the full cock position.

As I mentioned, the early CVA locks did not have a bridle so the only thing that kept the tumbler where it should be was the fit of the one axle thru the lockplate.

With the tremendous pressure exerted by the mainspring on the tumbler and only one axle to keep the tumbler where it should be, the hole thru the lockplate for the tumbler quickly wore out, making the lock basically useless.
If left un-oiled, a bridle-less lock could wear out rapidly.

This is where the bridle comes into play.

By adding another, usually smaller axle to the other side of the tumbler and placing a bridle with a hole in it to guide this pin in the tumbler, it now is located by two axles, one on either side and both axles share the heavy load from the mainspring.

This is what makes a "bridled" lock much better than an unbridled lock.

In the picture below you can see the exposed end of the tumblers axle and the bridle that supports it.


The bridle on this lock is rather fancy and it is held in place by two screws.
The tumbler axle is just above the fancy curve on the lower side of the bridle.
Just Jim...



 
vgorilla 
32 Cal.
Posts: 8
12-08-17 03:03 AM - Post#1655760    

    In response to Zonie

Thanks for the info ,i need to get my tc renegade out and check the lock on it. i was curious about a full stock long barrel gun Traditions are all i could find with full stock .for a low buck production rifle.


 
Phil Coffins 
40 Cal.
Posts: 132
Phil Coffins
12-08-17 11:06 AM - Post#1655801    

    In response to vgorilla

Your TC is a fine starter rifle and TC rifles still show up our local gun shows at reasonable prices. For a long rifle check out Dixie gun works.
As to Traditions Kentuckys I have one I'm helping a fellow with. He bought it last year at Cabela's and it has no bridle in the lock.

 
Grenadier1758 
58 Cal.
Posts: 2344
Grenadier1758
12-08-17 03:27 PM - Post#1655854    

    In response to vgorilla

The lock on your T/C Renegade will have a coil spring as the mainspring. As far as percussion locks go, they are fast and reliable.

 
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