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Login Name Post: Turner Kirkland barrels        (Topic#275262)
steve1122 
40 Cal.
Posts: 395
steve1122
12-09-12 09:23 PM - Post#1224327    


Has anybody had any experence with these barrels? I've heard that Dixie Gunworks put them out some years ago. Just wondering how they stacked up to other barrels?

 
Geo T 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1768
12-10-12 06:38 PM - Post#1224698    

    In response to steve1122

My guess is that it's pretty good quality. Dixie his company was the sorce for many years. In fact back in the 60's they started many of us off with their rifle kits and supplies! Geo. T.

 
Zonie 
Moderator
Posts: 25659
Zonie
12-10-12 07:52 PM - Post#1224738    

    In response to Geo T

Back in the days, Dixie sold a number of different makers barrels.

I don't know for sure but I would expect a barrel that was marked with a Turner Kirkland name on it might be pretty good.
If we are speaking of barrels sold by Turner Kirkland without his name on it, it might be another kettle of fish.

In the Dixie Gunworks 1980 catalog it lists barrels made by Douglas, Numrich and "Kentucky Rifle Barrels" made in Italy.

In both the Douglas and Numrich listings there is a special note that says,

"Occasionally, you will find one end of a barrel off center. When this occurs, put the off center at the breech end where the breechplug goes This does not affect the accuracy of the barrel."

A good gunmaker would not only position the offset at the rear but would make sure it was located towards the bottom of the barrel channel.
This would cause the barrel to shoot slightly high so a taller front sight was often used.

In this catalog, they also list a number of unrifled (smooth) rifle barrels.
Just Jim...



 
steve1122 
40 Cal.
Posts: 395
steve1122
12-11-12 10:45 AM - Post#1224940    

    In response to Zonie

Thanks Guys! Do you have any idea when these barrels were made?

 
flehto 
Cannon
Posts: 7622
12-12-12 07:16 AM - Post#1225393    

    In response to steve1122

My first built LR in 1977 had a Dixie bbl made by Douglas and it was a real shooter. As I recall, Dixie also had Numrich Arms bbls and a cheaper bbl by an unknown maker.....possibly Belgian....Fred

 
Dan Phariss 
70 Cal.
Posts: 4622
Dan Phariss
12-12-12 08:55 AM - Post#1225429    

    In response to steve1122

  • steve1122 Said:
Has anybody had any experence with these barrels? I've heard that Dixie Gunworks put them out some years ago. Just wondering how they stacked up to other barrels?



Honestly?
DGW sold a lot of REALLY cheap junk over the years. This said the name brand stuff especially was OK and my second ML was a DGW Squirrel Rifle made in Belgium. Once I shot it enough to smooth the barrel, 30-40 shots IIRC (lot of water under the Bridge since then) it was very accurate and the rifle was reliable. But I suspect coming from Belgium it had an actual barrel steel barrel. Something that was not on my radar at the time anyway.
In barrels I would much rather have a Green Mountain, it would be worth paying more for.

Dan

 
bonron 
40 Cal.
Posts: 157
12-12-12 09:59 AM - Post#1225458    

    In response to steve1122

Steve1122 - In 1965 I bought a 40cal full stock rifle kit from DGW for $125.00 plus shipping. It was my first build. If memory serves me I believe the barrel was made in Belgium. I remember that it shot accurately enough that others wanted to buy it so I sold it. Would you believe I found that rifle again. I tried to buy it, just for nostalgia, but the guy won't part with it. It just stands in his safe. Sorry I digressed. The barrels and other stuff Turner sold back then probably wouldn't pass muster today but back then they were state of the art and were the best available. Ron

Edited by bonron on 12-12-12 10:00 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Dan Phariss 
70 Cal.
Posts: 4622
Dan Phariss
12-12-12 10:44 AM - Post#1225475    

    In response to bonron

Much of it did not "pass muster" in the 60s either. Early on a lot of the guns were from Belgium. But as the Civil War centennial came around more and more guns came from Italy and early on many of these, sold by anyone, were pretty poor. But they were cheaper than Belgium I guess so the profit margins were higher.
There were other, better suppliers at the time.
DGW had a LOT of stuff nobody else had. Old parts and such. Turner had bought several semi-loads of stuff from Bannerman, gun parts, Civil War and Indian War leather goods etc etc. I used quite a few of their "Spencer" mainsprings in Sharps rifles to replace the factory spring. Changing the spring and fixing the firing pin was good for a couple inches smaller groups at 300 yards.

Turner Kirkland provided an invaluable service to ML shooters in the 50s and 60s. Its easy to forget this. The Belgium made Squirrel rifles were certainly not worse than the TC stuff and were head a shoulders over some of the outright junk being sold by numerous places. 29.95 "Kentucky Pistols" and rifles for just a little more. I shot my DGW Squirrel rifle a lot and killed many squirrels with it.

Dan

 
Billnpatti 
Cannon
Posts: 7229
Billnpatti
12-12-12 11:45 AM - Post#1225499    

    In response to Dan Phariss

Don't forget the junk guns that came from Japan in the 60s. Fortunatley, they did not stay on the market very long. I don't know if Turnner Kirkland sold any of these guns at Dixie Gun Works but I know Herter's sold them and described them in terms that would have you believing they were the finest gun ever made. But then reading the Herter's catalog, they would have you believe that everything in there was the standard by which quality was measured. There were a few jewels to be had but most was junk. Not the least of the junk were their Japanese made muzzleloading "Kentucky" rifles. In my estimation, they were nothing more than a pipe bomb on a stick. But, alas, none of my diatribe has anything to do with the subject of Turner Kirkland barrels. Sorry.

 
TennesseeJed 
40 Cal.
Posts: 216
12-12-12 05:31 PM - Post#1225686    

    In response to steve1122

I have a Belgian made Kirkland Guns .45 halfstock. A .440 ball and .015 patch goes down easier than you can imagine so the bore may be closer to .46. It shoots pretty good and would probably be even better if I recrowned it.

 
Flaydermaus 
40 Cal.
Posts: 363
Flaydermaus
12-12-12 08:16 PM - Post#1225787    

    In response to steve1122

My introduction to this sport began with this Dixie catalog:





A whole new world of firearms opened up for a geeky 15 year old...enjoy the "antique" information







Shreck
Macungie or Mahony, The Bear Is Still Here


 
Cynthialee 
70 Cal.
Posts: 4985
Cynthialee
12-12-12 08:30 PM - Post#1225803    

    In response to Flaydermaus

I notice in the introduction on the cover by Elmer when he is talking about hunting grouse that he mentions blowing down his barrel after his shot to soften fouling...






 
M.D. 
70 Cal.
Posts: 4512
12-12-12 08:58 PM - Post#1225824    

    In response to steve1122

I'm guessing that is what I have on my .58cal Buffalo hunter and if so I am very impressed with it. It has been a very accurate rifle with the maxi ball I made for it and it is choked at the muzzle which I also like.MD

 
steve1122 
40 Cal.
Posts: 395
steve1122
12-13-12 05:12 PM - Post#1226160    

    In response to Flaydermaus

Thanks Dennis! That was some great info.

 
RedFeather 
50 Cal.
Posts: 1226
12-13-12 07:56 PM - Post#1226226    

    In response to steve1122

The folks in those catalogues never age, LOL. I just got a new one and the pictures are the same.

 
Zonie 
Moderator
Posts: 25659
Zonie
12-13-12 08:04 PM - Post#1226232    

    In response to Flaydermaus

$24.95 for a barrel!
That's outrageous!

At the rate we're going, someday folks will be paying $200 for a barrel !
Just Jim...



 
Flaydermaus 
40 Cal.
Posts: 363
Flaydermaus
12-14-12 12:32 PM - Post#1226505    

    In response to Zonie

Zonie,
When I received the catalog, that barrel WAS $200.00 ...according to my wallet at the time
Shreck
Macungie or Mahony, The Bear Is Still Here


 
Dan Phariss 
70 Cal.
Posts: 4622
Dan Phariss
12-14-12 01:16 PM - Post#1226520    

    In response to Zonie

  • Zonie Said:
$24.95 for a barrel!
That's outrageous!

At the rate we're going, someday folks will be paying $200 for a barrel !



These were not premium barrels by any means.
I used a couple of Numrich barrels and they were not something I would want today.
Similar barrels are 150 today except the Green Mountains are better steel. Douglas were not machined but drilled from cold rolled octagonal bar stock. So there was run out at the breech.

Dad bought a new 1600 IHC cab and chassis truck long enough for a 15' bed for 3200 in 1964. It would carry 26000 gvw and run 70+ on the flat loaded.

Very nice pickups could be bought in the 1970s for less than 7000.
Now top of the line gasser 1/2 tons can run to 50K.
I have a barrel in a rifle and one in the safe I gave 425 for and do not regret in the slightest. In fact I am glad I bought them. Wish I have a pair of 40 cals for a double barrel or Swivel breech. But his production is way down.
In 1970 I smuggled a Colt Commander to VN in my shaving kit. Dad gave 125 bucks for it at the Coast to Coast Store in Oelwein, IA. brand new. 895 and up today.

So its that the money is becoming increasingly worthless.

Dan


 
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