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Login Name Post: how to measure inside barrel diameter?        (Topic#270974)
Matt85 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1538
07-14-12 06:16 PM - Post#1167509    


i need an accurate measurement of my armisport 1842 rifled musket barrel. any suggestions on how to go about this?

thank you

 
Anonymous 
07-14-12 06:52 PM - Post#1167517    

    In response to Matt85

Get some Cerrosafe from Track (cheapest place I know of) It melts under 190 degrees. Stuff a wad of paper bowl down the bore, melt and pour in the cerrosafe, with a hooked piece of coat hanger wire or something to make a handle. let cool then pull out measure with calipers.
Cerrosafe www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/1212/1/CER...

Bill

 
Matt85 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1538
07-14-12 06:52 PM - Post#1167518    

    In response to Matt85

sorry i posted this in a hurry, the title should read: how to measure the inside barrel diameter?

 
GoodCheer 
Cannon
Posts: 6023
GoodCheer
07-14-12 07:26 PM - Post#1167527    

    In response to Matt85

Cerrosafe is great for the groove diameter. If you want the bore diameter, that's a tough one.
In order to accurately measure mine I used a Starrett bore micrometer with three points of contact.

Do you know anyone that works in a machine shop, machine tool type of company, or somebody that knows somebody? The reason that I ask is that borrowing one, or better yet taking the barrel only to a shop, would be a great way to go if you could. And they might love having a break from boredom (no pun intended).

 
necchi 
Cannon
Posts: 11894
necchi
07-14-12 08:18 PM - Post#1167540    

    In response to Matt85

Find a section of 3/8-1/2" brass rod about a foot long and slide in down the bore.
Flatten a ball with a mallet or 2x4 till it's over size for the bore, then pound it into the bore with the same 2x4,
Turn the barrel upsidedown and use the brass rod inside as a hammer to knock it out.

If a ball will fit down the bore loose enough without a patch maybe that can be used instead of a brass rod.
JohnT
Molon Labe~


 
Jethro224 
Moderator
Posts: 7428
Jethro224
07-14-12 09:08 PM - Post#1167552    

    In response to Matt85

  • Matt85 Said:
sorry i posted this in a hurry, the title should read: how to measure the inside barrel diameter?



Fixed it.



 
Matt85 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1538
07-15-12 06:24 AM - Post#1167620    

    In response to Jethro224

  • Jethro224 Said:

Fixed it.




thanks!

hrm no i dont know any one who would have a bore micrometer, not sure of any local machine shops either.

had another person recently recomend hammering a piece of lead in the barrel. i do have some .690 lead balls i suppose i could flatten down. but, where the heck would i get a piece of brass rod that will work?



 
necchi 
Cannon
Posts: 11894
necchi
07-15-12 11:51 AM - Post#1167712    

    In response to Matt85

Hobby Shop?
All you need is something heavy, smaller diameter than the bore and softer than the steel barrel.
Ya might have something around the house??

Cerrosafe is easy too, you can melt it in a soup can. The alloy metal is poured molten at 190,
(less than boiling water)
then in 5 minutes it shrinks, in 60 minutes it returns to the actual size then shinks again slowly in 24hrs.
If ya goof something up and the cerrosafe gets stuck in the muzzle, ya just stick the muzzle in boiling water and the cerrosafe melts again,,
JohnT
Molon Labe~


 
Old Pilgrim 
40 Cal.
Posts: 219
07-15-12 02:21 PM - Post#1167745    

    In response to Matt85

If you know anyone who works in a tool shop they will have a set of gauge pins, that"s what I use to measure mine with.

 
Matt85 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1538
07-15-12 04:15 PM - Post#1167781    

    In response to necchi

the thing that worries me about cerrosafe is that i would need to stop up the bore somehow so it stays in one spot in a liquid form.

maby i could smash a lead ball in and use a Co2 ball puller to get the lead out. the Co2 canisters arent expensive so its not a major loss. perhaps if i fired the lead out of the barrel with Co2 into something soft like a blanket or a towel it might work...

 
flehto 
Cannon
Posts: 7687
07-16-12 02:27 PM - Post#1168125    

    In response to Old Pilgrim

For bore or "land" dia. pin gages are the way to go. Groove dia. measurement is easier w/ even groove/land bores...pound an oversize plug of lead down the bore and mike it. Odd numbered groove/land bores require a much more extensive setup for measuring the groove dia. on a lead plug.....Fred

 
Rifleman1776 
Cannon
Posts: 13721
Rifleman1776
07-16-12 04:15 PM - Post#1168178    

    In response to Matt85

The lead ball is the classic way to go. But, as said, a brass rod might be hard to locate and would be expensive.
Another way is to make a rod with something on the bottom, like cardboard or felt. Pour in the molten lead, let harden then pull out.
And, no, the cardboard or felt won't burn up.

 
dcriner 
40 Cal.
Posts: 268
07-16-12 04:46 PM - Post#1168184    

    In response to Rifleman1776

Why not just use an inside caliper? With an even number of lands, just measure across two opposite lands. With an odd number of lands, measure between a land and the opposite groove, and then deduct the land height.


 
Dan Phariss 
70 Cal.
Posts: 4622
Dan Phariss
07-16-12 05:08 PM - Post#1168191    

    In response to Matt85

  • Matt85 Said:
i need an accurate measurement of my armisport 1842 rifled musket barrel. any suggestions on how to go about this?

thank you



Why?
Does Armisport have a website?
May show land and groove dimensions of the barrels.
I think Pedersoli does.
Dan

 
woodse guy 
40 Cal.
Posts: 461
07-16-12 05:36 PM - Post#1168199    

    In response to Matt85

If you decide that you need a brass rod send me a PM with your address I have one that you can use and then send back to me when your done. Might take me a couple of days to find it, but if you need it let me know.

 
Matt85 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1538
07-16-12 07:35 PM - Post#1168246    

    In response to woodse guy

  • woodse guy Said:
If you decide that you need a brass rod send me a PM with your address I have one that you can use and then send back to me when your done. Might take me a couple of days to find it, but if you need it let me know.



thanks for the offer!

i managed to slug the bore by hammering a .690 ball out a little bit, then hammering the flatter ball into the barrel. after getting the slug all the way in the barrel i used a C02 ball puller to launch the slug into an old towel.

the diameter of the slug is pretty sporatic though. using a micrometer at work i measured it at any where from .700 to .694 but it seems on average to be around .696 +/- .001.

i think a .694 minie ball is what i want for this gun. not sure what the ideal ball size is though and i may make a second post about proper ball diameter.

 
hawken hunter 60 
40 Cal.
Posts: 432
07-16-12 07:57 PM - Post#1168254    

    In response to Matt85

Do you know some one that may work in a machine shop? They should have access to gauge pins. They go in .0001 of an inch increments in size. That's how I measured mine. Just find the one that just fits in the bore. The next that is .0001 larger than that one will not fit. The previous size pin is your bore diameter.

HH 60

Edited by hawken hunter 60 on 07-16-12 08:01 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
necchi 
Cannon
Posts: 11894
necchi
07-17-12 12:33 AM - Post#1168336    

    In response to Matt85

  • Matt85 Said:
i used a C02 ball puller to launch the slug into an old towel.



It worked! Cool,
Gonna hafta salt that one away for later on.
Did you drive the slug all the way to the breech? Or just into the bore?
JohnT
Molon Labe~


 
Matt85 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1538
07-17-12 02:54 AM - Post#1168345    

    In response to necchi

  • necchi Said:
  • Matt85 Said:
i used a C02 ball puller to launch the slug into an old towel.



It worked! Cool,
Gonna hafta salt that one away for later on.
Did you drive the slug all the way to the breech? Or just into the bore?



just the bore, but thinking about it now i probably should have gone to the breech... i think it will be ok. am sending the slug, my measurements, and a .685 lyman minie ball mold to Erik at hollowpointmold.com. he told me that he can size the mold up to match my needs. (probaby .694)

his price seems reasonable, $45 + $6.50 for shipping.

Edited by Matt85 on 07-17-12 02:57 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
KV Rummer 
40 Cal.
Posts: 266
07-20-12 08:08 AM - Post#1169620    

    In response to Matt85

I have a taper gage made by Starrett. It looks like a set of feeler gages but each leaf is tapered and scribed with a scale indicating width. The gage is No. 269B, has ten leaves and measures from .500 to 1.000. It is inserted into the muzzle and the width (diameter) is read on the scale at the point of contact with the muzzle ID.

This will only give the diameter at the end of the muzzle but most times this is what I want to know. Very fast and low hassle.

Starrett also makes a No. 269A that measures from .100 to .500 which is good for checking centerfire rifles when sizing your cast bullets.

Only works with an even number of lands.


 
Pete D. 
45 Cal.
Posts: 976
07-29-12 05:10 AM - Post#1172834    

    In response to KV Rummer

Glad that you were able to do what you set out to do.
I kept asking myself, though, why this concern over the bore size beyond what is stated on the gun. I do appreciate the "l just wanted to know" mindset if that is what the motive was.
just wonderin'.
For future reference: Brass rods are readily and quickly available from McMaster-Carr. I keep a few at different sizes around.
"Only hunting and mountain climbing are sports. The rest are just games." R. Ruark


 
Matt85 
54 Cal.
Posts: 1538
07-29-12 04:43 PM - Post#1173029    

    In response to Pete D.

  • Pete D. Said:
Glad that you were able to do what you set out to do.
I kept asking myself, though, why this concern over the bore size beyond what is stated on the gun. I do appreciate the "l just wanted to know" mindset if that is what the motive was.
just wonderin'.
For future reference: Brass rods are readily and quickly available from McMaster-Carr. I keep a few at different sizes around.



in my case, whats stated on the gun is wrong and i knew this. i just didnt know how wrong it was

armisport claims this is a 69 caliber rifle which would make the bore diameter somewhere around .687. this rifle is in fact around .694-.696. thats almost .01 oversized . as a minie ball rifle i need to use minies that are close to .002 under land diameter in order to get good accuracy. (a standard 69 cal rifle would use a .685 minie while my rifle will use a .692 or .694 minie)

 
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