What is a swamped barrel??

I am sure this is a really basic question, but I don't know... I have a TC Renegade, does it have a swamped barrel?

Thanks!!

Swamped barrels are those which taper from the breech end down to a point past the middle (we might say 3/5 of the length from the breech but it can vary) & then flares till it reaches the muzzle (but still smaller across the flats than the breech end). Swamped barrels are more expensive than those with straight (parallel) sides or those with a simple taper from the breech to the muzzle. Swamped barrels are typically have much better balance, particularly in long barrels. You will find swamped barrels on higher end guns that reflect earlier periods when most rifles had hand made barrels. Straight barrels (then as now) tend to be shorter and are more typical of factory (machined) barrels.

happyhunter said:

I have a TC Renegade, does it have a swamped barrel?

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No, its a straight, 1" inch thick octagon barrel.

To go along with Coot's description, scroll down the barrel page here and you'll see dimensional diagrams of swamped barrels...
http://www.ricebarrels.com/chart.html

If it's a factory barrel, then no, it isn't swamped.

A swamped barrel tapers down from the breech towards the muzzle, and then flares back out before the muzzle.

Here's a pic that shows it better than I can explain it.

Interesting, thinner in the middle. Are they octagon or round? I imagine such a barrel would be hard to make if it were octagon.

happyhunter said:

Interesting, thinner in the middle. Are they octagon or round? I imagine such a barrel would be hard to make if it were octagon.

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Octagon....the flats are 'draw-filed'...ie: you could even have your Renegage barrel swamped if you wanted to pay someone to do then then reblue it, etc.

Big benefits of swamping longer barrels is weight reduction and improving balance...and the taper can then also add to the asthetics some

The term is normally used with octagon shaped rifled barrels (not just rifle barrels - one of my pistols has a swamped barrel) Yes, they are harder to make (by machine at least) & thus modern swamped barrels cost more and are generally found on custom guns. While some fowlers have tapered round barrels that may have a bit of flare at the muzzle, the term "swamped" is not normally used for them.

To keep the facts straight - Not all swamped barrels were or are octagonal - historically they were made in octagonal, full length round, and octagon to round.......

LaBonte said:

"...octagon to round..."

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Seems like a "swamped octagon to round barrel" would be a geometric challenge to build and still look good

LaBonte said:

To keep the facts straight - Not all swamped barrels were or are octagonal - historically they were made in octagonal, full length round, and octagon to round.......

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Are there any photos or docs to show a full-length, round, swamped barrel?

Are there any photos or docs to show an octagon to round, swamped barrel?

My Chamber's English Fowler has a full-length, swamped round barrel.

Oct/round here,
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(S(s...d=14&subId=142&styleId=493&PageSize=10&Page=3

Couple of questions.
Is the thinking behind a swamped barrel that you reduce the weight, but you leave enough meat at the muzzle end so that you can dovetail for the front sight?
Also, is the "swamping" on some modern ML'er barrels a bit exaggerated or did they really leave the metal that thin in the middle?

interesting.....they make a rifled version of that barrel too.

Joe Mandt said:

Couple of questions.
Is the thinking behind a swamped barrel that you reduce the weight, but you leave enough meat at the muzzle end so that you can dovetail for the front sight?
Also, is the "swamping" on some modern ML'er barrels a bit exaggerated or did they really leave the metal that thin in the middle?

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A swamped barrel will be noticeably lighter and balance further back than a straight barrel with the same breech dimensions. You don't need to leave too much metal at the muzzle for a dovetail - pressure will be lower than at the breech end so you don't need as much thickness, also keep in mind that these barrels are normally held in place by pinning to the stock - so even the thinner part near the middle could wind up being cut for a dovetail to hold under barrel lugs for pinning. A swamped .50 rifle of mine has four dovetails cut under the barrel that hold lugs for pinning the barrel to the stock.

As to new vs old barrels & the amount or degree of swamping, then & now, there are so many variations of each that I would hesitate to generalize. Certainly there is a happy medium as to the amount of swamping in any barrel - too much & it is weak for it's size and too little leaves it heavy both to carry and at the muzzle. I like to think that the builders then & now realize that. Perhaps some of our builders on the board call add insight......

Joe Mandt said:

Couple of questions.
Is the thinking behind a swamped barrel that you reduce the weight, but you leave enough meat at the muzzle end so that you can dovetail for the front sight?
Also, is the "swamping" on some modern ML'er barrels a bit exaggerated or did they really leave the metal that thin in the middle?

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Right-O on all points, Joe. Not only do you leave enough meat for a dovetail for the front sight, but you have enough meat that the sight does not need to be taller than the rear sight. On a tapered barrel w/o the flare, unless the front sight it tall, it shoots high.

Most all the standard octagonal swamped barrels today (A-D weight from Colerain, Getz, Green Mountain, Longhammock, etc) are exaggerated compared to what was used say, 1770-1790. Earlier swamped barrels could be as exaggerated as what are sold today. I think they make them exaggerated to get the best "bang for the buck" in providing weight savings and balance qualities. Not sure folks would pay the extra for a small gain in balance and weight savings. But a buddy and I just had a couple of barrels made by Bobby Hoyt with more of a 1770's profile because we're replicating a specific original. Not as wasp-waisted.

"SWAMPED" - when and where did the term come into use? - Bill

"Swamped" also refers to a barrel (after the fact) that has been very, very, very disappointing, read that, lousy. :rotf:

Are there any photos or docs to show a full-length, round, swamped barrel?

Are there any photos or docs to show an octagon to round, swamped barrel?[/quote]
Yes - there are you just got to do the research the same way I did.........

LaBonte said:

Are there any photos or docs to show a full-length, round, swamped barrel?

Are there any photos or docs to show an octagon to round, swamped barrel?

Yes - there are you just got to do the research the same way I did.........

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It's rude to have a member tell a person, "find it yourself". Very discouraging for the novice.

Quite often, when people ask questions on a forum, others will point them to the information. Two others gave some examples (thanks Grizzly and Swampy), but obviously you're not that kind of person.