How much to get started?

Welcome to the insanity....remember to keep your eyes open at flea markets and yard sales, one of my secrets is to always check the boxes filled with kitchen stuff...some people who are not familiar with BP tools and accessories think they are some old kitchen thingy...I have found several old ball molds in with the melon scoops and such....

Hit the jackpot last week, mixed in with a lot of old tools was a small box containing not one...but seven main spring vices???? all brand new... gjr902 picket out three and I took the last four...all for $3 each

Also saw some nice old horns that someone went ahead and drilled 3/8 - 1/2 holes thru in a couple places to hang on the walls...

One of the most important items to buy as a newbie is a BALL PULLER....

Who didn't have too much OIL in their flintlock and have a flash in the pan and NO BOOM and have to get the ball out in the first month (or two days) of shooting????!!!

[..... cricket sounds.]

Yup, that is what I am saying. Get a ball puller in your very first order of accessories/gear. You will NOT regret it.

All in all if you start with like a Lyman Flintlock you can get into it with accessories and supplies for under $750 ish.

You also get alot of enjoyment for no extra charge. Really not that many hobbies that can be started for less money.
Don

Jackman
I'm surprised that no-one has mentioned making your own stuff. Buy the best factory or custom rifle you can manage, but all the other things like horn, bag, balls, powder measure, clothing and I'm sure many other things you think you'll need are pretty easily made with some research and little craftyness, for much, much less than it would cost to buy. Many of the people here make thier own stuff, at least some of it.

To me that part of the hobby is as much fun as the shooting. Spend the bulk of your money on the rifle of your choice, then make your accoutrements. About the only thing you're not likely to make yourself is black Powder @ $20-$25 per lb. or $14 per lb in 25 lb lots.

Buy a good used TC for 250-400 bucks, a pound of Goex 3f (pan/barrel), powder measure,ball and some flints. Should be good to go for under $500.00.

You can make just about anything else you need to shoot. Now wants; that's another thing and wants can be expensive. I just bought 2 GM drop-in barrels for 200 bucks a piece. I didn't need any more barrels but I wanted a .54 and a .58 before they were discontinued and I couldn't get them anymore. Watch out for the wants and it's not that expensive to do traditional muzzleloading. The custom long guns can get a bit pricy but it will be a while before you get there.

This stuff is fun and addictive but I justify it with working overtime; no smoking or buying expensive items.

the short answer to your thousand dollar question is an unqualified "yes, but ... " i assume that you have not developed a penchant for expensive gadgets (this comes later) and so you will be able to get in to the hobby for well under two thirds that figure if you are frugal. Now, two more or less relevant jokes:

Little Jonnie is in class and the vocabulary word for the day is 'frugal,' which one of Jonnie's classmates tells him means to save, so when asked to use the word in a sentence, Jonnie yells out, "There's a princess in the tower and the evil witch is about to hurt her and she yells out the window: "FRUGAL ME, OH PLEASE FRUGAL ME!"

... well, i guess you had to be there ...

joke number two:

the fellow has a boat load of money, and wants to build a house, so he goes to the town architect, and they discuss at length the features this guy wants in the building, after which the architect confirms the budget and then asks the fellow, "So, how big exactly is your dog?"

having said that, the answer to your question still stands: you can do this for much less than a thousand dollars if you're halfway careful.

I think you'll need

a rifle. (used is perfectly fine. remember, all guns are used after you shoot them for the first time.) I wouldn't hesitate to buy any gun from this site sight unseen, because that's the way the folks are here. If you're going to the local pawn shop, you should take someone who is knowledgeable, not because the pawnbroker is an unsavory character, but because the pawnbroker may or may not know much about guns in general or flintlocks in particular.

powder. if you can find it locally, get it. otherwise, it will be more cost efficient to buy it in bulk (assuming that you can afford to do so). ignore those who tell you to make your own: this is illegal, dangerous, and will not product a consistent product.

an adjustable powder measure. just saw one on Track of the Wolf for about fifteen bucks. get one with a spout/funnel thingie - this will make it easier to pour the measured powder into the barrel.

something in which to keep the powder. usually a horn, but you don't have to have a horn ... this will do (i have a less sophisticated one, but this guy will close, which mine won't
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/81/1/POWDER-CAP-F

some flints ... get them from Mr. Pierce... he's on this site and a great fellow and his flints are a very good buy.

something to keep the flints in the cock. either leather of lead. if you can't find a bit of scrap leather, send me a PM and I'll filtch some from my daughter, who runs a leather working business and has tons of scraps. If you want to try lead, squish a ball flat and that will work fine. There is extensive discussion about the lead vs. leather controversy (use the search feature on this site). I would recommend that you try both methods and use the one which works best for you.

a priming horn of some sort. you will need to get whatever priming powder you use from the container to the pan in a regulated manner. if you can find one, i would recommend a free flow valve over the usual three or four grain dispenser. also, you should be forewarned that the powder will eventually corrode on the surface of the dispenser and clog up the works, so don't be shy about taking the thing apart for cleaning every now and again.

a screwdriver this should fit both the screws to the lock and the slot at the top of the cock. this should be a dedicated tool to the gun- not something you borrow from your tool kit. (as an aside, you should consider putting a hole in the cockscrew, so that you can tighten down the cock and get a really good set on the flint. send me a PM on how to do this if you're unsure)

a 'range rod.' this gadget is like a ramrod, but much better: you will have added length, and it's probably stronger than the rod in your gun, and while your gun's ramrod may or may not accomodate accessories, a proper range rod will allow you to thread on brushes or jags or whatever you need to clean your gun. (just be sure that you're using the same thread size for everything --

don't ask me how i know this) :redface: :redface: :redface:

if your range rod doesn't have a ball puller, you will need one. "dryball" is loading a ball and patch without putting any powder in the barrel first. there are three groups: group one is composed of those who have dryballed and admit it, group two is made up of those who will eventually dryball, and group three is populated by those who have dryballed and insist that they have never made this mistake.


patching material. you can get precut, prelubed patches, but most of us would rather cut and lube out own. cloth can be had a t any dry goods place; i get mine from JoAnne's fabrics, or the local WalMart. for now, cut patches with a scissors, or if you want to get fancy, cut at the muzzle.

a lubricant of some sort. dry patches are an anethema. and they don't work, either. there are a zillion lube recipies, and if none of them strike your fancy, you can always use plain old spit. avoid lubes with petrochemicals in them: they're hard to clean and i hold that they do not work as well.

roundball. try some precast before you take the plunge and get a casting rig of your own. You will develop a load which will get you the tightest groups, and this may or may not be a ball of a common diameter, so get some ball from a caster and see how it works. you don't need to buy swaged balls from Speer or Hornady: they are wicked expensive and don't have any benefit unless you're a world- class shooter. avoid 'magic bullets' such as minnie balls, musket doo- dads, or the latest greatest whiz bang thing- a- ma- bob being hawked about by those who's real agenda is to separate you from your hard earned money. stick to PRB (patched roundball) - you'll be glad you did.

a short starter. this looks like a billiard ball with a four to six inch stick put into it. you pour the powder into the barrel, put the patch on the top of the muzzle, put the ball in the middle of the patch, put the stick of the short starter on the ball and give it a whack with the palm of your hand. In goes the ball and patch. you finish ramming the whole deal with the range rod, and you're ready to prime and fire.

other "duh" stuff. Targets, cleaning patches, a staple gun, duct tape, hearing and eye protection, a case or cover for your gun, and a container in which to carry all your stuff. (i will confess to still using my tackle box on occasion.)

you might want to consider Dutch Schoultz' monograph on muzzle loading accuracy. his link is
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...zsGPCQ&usg=AFQjCNEZwyWa1zeoCDC50H7jmzsilOQndQ

or just put his name and the phrase 'muzzle loading accuracy' into your search engine.

you can also make just about anything you need for yourself, depending on your skill level, inclination, and time available. There are a bunch of good videos and instruction books on this subject.

welcome to the wonderful world of muzzle loading, but be forewarned: (to paraphrase Yoda) ...once the smoke smelled have you, forever will it dominate your range time.

Lyman GPR and the basics could be around $500

Lyman GPR (kit or used or new)
1 pound of powder 3F
Powder measure
1 Box of lead balls
A couple of flints
Prelubed wads
Ball Puller
Cleaning brush appropriate to caliber

That is the most basic list. To start you really do not need more. That is what I started with and again I am glad i had the ball puller. I needed it the second day shooting ( :haha: )

The botton line is you can get started for 500 up. The problem is that is just the start. I got started in the dark ages (1969) with a $49.00 kit from Dixie. My muzzle loaders run the line from that kit to a $3000 custom. ( don't let my wife see that figure) Find you a good used rifle get some powder and shoot, the rest will take care of it's self. :thumbsup:

I agree on the ball puller...also make sure that the connector is "PINNED" to the ramrod, I had the unfortunate experience of starting to pull a ball and the puller and ramrod end came off down in the barrel.....a .02 cent cross pin would have saved a lot of time pulling the breech plug...

A decent flintlock rifle will run you about $500 and up. Powder ranges widely in price depending on where you live but expect to pay on average about $20 per pound. Flints weill run you about $2 each. I don't know what store bought balls cost because I cast my own. Lube is cheap, spit works really well for target shooting and something like olive oil will work fine for hunting. You can get a self closing spout for your powder can if you will be shooting at a bench. If you will be loading from a pouch, you will need a horn. Track Of The Wolf has them at a very reasonable price. You can get something servicable for around $25. Patch material is available by the yard from any fabric shop. If you need a pouch, watch this forum and folks like "cutfingers" will have one for sale from time to time. You can find one for something in the range of $75. I think that ought to get you started and then you will find other things that you simply "must have" as you go along. Oh, I forgot to add a powder measure. You can find an adjustable measure for around $25 or you can make a non-addjustable measure yourself that will measure out the powder charge that you find is the one your rifle likes best. You can make one from a spent rifle cartridge. Just cut it down until it holds the right amount of powder. If you start out with a thousand dollar bill, you should be able to get all of the basic gear that you will need and still have a bit of change left. Then if you get into any of the aspects of muzzleloading that requires a costume and various accouterments, you will need to dig down in your pocket and pull out another thousand dollar bill to get started. Muzzleloading can be pretty reasonable or it can get real expensive in a hurry. It all depends on what you want to do.

Thanks to the internet, you can shop all over for the best prices. A .54 Lyman GPR flinter for $469 at DNR Sports: http://www.dnrsports.com/catalog/product/f3fbf36ab8d9a6a104ca299c0fd8d04b . Track of the Wolf has a possible bag for $22.99: http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/50/3/BAG-RT-SU , powder horn for $12.99: http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/76/1/HORN-D and adjustable powder measure for $11.99: http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/85/1/MA-120 . The horn does not have straps, but I go to Wal-Mart and get the leather boot laces . While at Wal-Mart, pick up a couple of yards of pillow ticking for patches and a couple of tards of cotton flanel for cleaning patches. At Dixie, they have a short starter for $6.50: http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_info.php?cPath=22_99_320&products_id=3732 and a range rod for $16.25: http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_info.php?cPath=22_99_320&products_id=1302 . A paper clip unfolded half way make a great vent pick. I use knapped flints. You can find them at Track of the Wolf, Dixie or even from Rich Pierce from the forum here. Since this is a flinter, you will need real black powder. Normally, Cabela's stores and Bass Pro Shops will carry black powder. Here are a couple of places for mail order: http://www.powderinc.com/ and http://www.grafs.com/ . It sounds like a lot, but once you have this gear, you have it. I recommend shooting round balls. They are cheaper to buy, just as accurate and just as deadly as conicals. Later, you may consider casting your own. Good luck and have fun :thumbsup:

And of course add in the cost of divorce for when you really, truly get into it. :rotf:

It will depend on what level you want to start at, one can go witrh an inexpensive import and take your chances or get a quality domestic made gun, the accesories are variable and many listed not really needed such as a priming horn as you can prime with the same powder from the same horn as you load from, used is a good way to get into a quality gun for little cost, of course if you want only the very best it will have to be a TVM

Hey fellas; wait for me !!!!
What about beads?
Gotta have beads so we look good ....
Don't forget the trade beads ...
BWHaaaaaaaaaaaaa.
Limpinfrog :blah: :youcrazy: :haha:

I can personally say to get started is fairly cheap. What happens after is where the $$ comes in. I was given a Springfield Hawken's and after $70 to TOTW and some very helpful advice and help from a friend who also builds very fine BP rifles.I've shot the dickens out of that rifle. Now the money starts to flow. In the post planning stages, custom left-handed 40cal Tenn. Poorboy flintlock.That rifle hasn't even started and I'm already scheming on another this time maybe a 32 or maybe a 45 or maybe both. I was warned by my friend that this was a sickness and now I have to feed it with another of my sicknesses by selling of some of my classic fly rods. I don't think I'll teach the Sweet Lucy how to load on of these things.
RFMcD

No flints from Mr.Pierce........
Macon

My two "cheap", but good flinter types are Lyman GPRs and a TC Hawken, and cost me between $300 to $450, depending on when and where I bought them. Flints, as has been said, a bit over a dollar a piece. Horn was $15-20, powder prices vary, but I use the same horn to prime so I dont need an extra priming horn. Last time I bought balls was probably 10 yrs ago, and I dont remember the price, but a Lee mold is about $20 as of a couple weeks ago and will cast as many as you're willing to cast and shoot, and then some. Patch cloth is sold at any cloth store and many other types that have a arts and crafts section like walmart too. So I will call it about $400 if I do the math using my $300 (used) TC.

Now this is where you run and dont look back because after this, you can't say you weren't warned. I have personally not gone off and bought or made proper clothing yet, but I do have a tipi in my "mancave" as SWMBO calls it, as I have been working on it and sewing it by hand for a while now, and getting close to done. I also have the poles set up in the back-yard, which a couple of the neighbors have asked about and laughed when I told them. I no longer carry a lighter, but do have a flint and steel in my wallet in the pocket next to my license so I always have it, just in case. I sold my motor boat, and bought a canoe instead. So in the end, it's all a matter of how deep into this hobby you want to get, and it can be done fairly cheap or make you go broke, but it's all your choice.

When buying a used rifle ALWAYS ask to run a tight fitting patch down the barrel. The patched ramrod should go smoothly all the way down. There should be no places where it jumps an inch or so on its way down.
That jump indicates a wider spot in the barrel caused by a bulge created when a ball was short started but not seated all the way down on the powder.
You will probably never get accuracy out of a bulged barrel.
The reason the rifle may be up for sale is because the previous owner could get no accuracy.
If the seller won't let you run the patch down the barrel, he knows whats wrong.

Just walk away.

This applies more to percussion rifles, but rather than using a ball puller which screws into the lead thus causing the ball to expand and get more firmly stuck in the bore,
If you can possibly force fine grained Black Powder through the touch hole and then fire it, it will cause the ball to move a bit toward the muzzle. This will allow you to force more powder through the touch hole, Maybe enough to to blow the stuck ball all the way out.
Ball puller will work but not as much as you will work trying to get the ball puller to work.

When I first got into Muzzleloading I read all the ads, bought everything and found most of them to not work or to be away too much bother. I ended up with 10 rifles.
As time passed I began to give them away and ended up with my first T/C Kit built .45 Hawken and replica Ozark Mountain Arms Hawken, also in .45
You can go nuts spending money on stuff.
If you have a rifle, Flint or percussion with an unbulged barrel and is capable of firing, you can achieve amazing accuracy.
People will spend up to a thousand or more on a rifle and expect it to shoot better. It won't unless the shooter knows what he's doing.
The more you spend, the prettier the rifle but it is till just a barrel and a way of firing it.