Powder Brand Advice

I have been shooting pyrodex in my revolver and have been completely satisfied with it. However, after purchasing my model 1780 flintlock i was told that the pyrodex would not shoot well if at all in it. My plan is to continue shooting the rest of my pyrodex, but to also buy real black powder for my flintlock. When the pyrodex is gone, i will shoot real black powder in both guns to keep from having to have 2 flasks and 2 different powders.

I have a friend at work whose family does alot of reenacting and supplies different reenactors with real black powder. The brands he gets are Elephant and i think something called Swiss. They are considerably cheaper ($15 dollars a pound from this gentleman) than the pyrodex. However, i haven't heard of these brands and really haven't seen anyone on here talking about them. Do you have any opinions on these brands as far as how well they shoot, how much they foul a gun, and so on? I am fairly new to BP shooting in general so the fact that i haven't heard of these is no surprise. Just wondering if it was worth going with instead of Goex, which i have heard good reviews about.

Elephant gets mixed reviews on this forum, some quite good and some quite poor. The company has had a complex history with ups and downs, which may explain the variation. I've never used used it. $15 a pound for Elephant sounds pretty reasonable for a local shop, certainly worth trying a pound.

Swiss is THE premium black powder, usually over $20 a pound. If he's really selling it for $15, I'd just buy his entire stock. Is Swiss really worth the premium? Some match shooters use it at matches, and then switch to something less pricey (GOEX Scheutzen, or Kik).

After you know what granulation you want, it is generally cheaper to buy a case off the internet, which adds to your choices. I've had good results with Goex, Kik, and Graff. Graff, Powder Inc. are good internet sources, but there are others.

Yeah pretty much what Greenmt said.

Can't go wrong with Swiss,Goex, Wano, Graff, Kik powders.

Elephant is good garden fertilizer.
I find Goex and Schutzen to be excellent.
But, Swiss, no doubt, is way ahead of all others.

I'm one of those who was satisfied with Elephant. Apparently it was from one of their "good" periods. It's no longer made as I understand it and has been replaced by "Diamondback" powder which has gotten better reviews than the old Elephant. I started out using Dupont, and when they dropped out of the bp market I used whatever came my way. I've been using Goex for years and it is an excellent and reasonably priced propellant. My nest order is "Jacks Battle Powder" which is cheaper than Goex but apparently made by them as an Off brand. It has gotten very good reviews.

I use Goex, have used some KIK

If you NEED the cleanest burning, most refined and highest velocity BP, Swiss is it.

The issue is NEED.

In competition, I always shoot SWISS.

On the basis of COST, GOEX is fine for hunting

Thanks for all the comments guys. And for not making me feel like an idiot! :thumbsup: Didn't realize swiss was so well liked.

Please do some reading. The higher Flashpoints of Substitute powders( Pyrodex, 777, etc.) makes them unsuitable to use as flash powder in a FLINTLOCK, and also more difficult to ignite inside the barrel. Even the maker of Pyrodex recommends using BP in your flash pan, and a " Booster charge" of BP down the barrel before pouring in the Pyrodex!

Some substitutes are specifically made to be used in Cartridge casings, ignited by modern primers. Others are designed to use n the Zip guns that use shotgun primers to ignite the powder charge in the barrel.

Most- if not all-- of the current substitutes lose power when exposed to air, over time, so that shooters must shoot up the powder within a couple of months, or sooner, or just use it as fertilizer after that! Its very expensive fertilizer!

Finally, almost all the " New" substitutes are being hawked as " Non-corrosive" to snag that part of the shooting market that is too lazy and irresponsible to clean their guns. Their guns wind up back at a gunshop to have expensive barrel and parts replacements, and usually result in the owners simply buying a new gun, as they are being sold so cheaply. ( I know dealers and gunsmiths here in Illinois and in Florida who face this every "Season" when new guys who bought all the hype from sales clerks at the "big box" stores come in to find out why their gun won't shoot the next year!)

Some of the flash points of these new substitute powders are so high that they ignite best using
Magnum" #11 percussion caps, or are intended for use with shotgun or modern primers.

There is nothing wrong with using these Substitute Powders for the purposes for which they are intended. CAS has a BP class, where substitute powders are allowed, and, loaded into a pistol cartridge casing, in front of modern primers, and sealed with a bullet, they do well. Powders made for use in those zip guns( in-XXXs) that use shotgun primers to ignite, are OK for that purpose. Just buy a new can every year before hunting season.

If someone tells you that you don't have to clean your new gun like you would with BP, if you buy their substitute powder, make them give you a Guarantee in writing that they will replace the gun if that proves to be false! ALL METAL CORRODES, EVEN STAINLESS STEELS!)

Best wishes. :thumbsup:

I've gone down the road of trying almost every powder that will burn and have come to the conclusion it is just hard to beat GOEX. :thumbsup:
Sometimes it is impossible to believe what some posters say on a forum because they get a burr under their saddle for a particular company or product and then honest evaluation is not likely. :hmm: Or maybe they have an agenda, ya never know.
But like Mr Vallandigham says, you need to clean your guns. No matter what you use. :wink:

Thanks for all the comments guys. And for not making me feel like an idiot!

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You skated this time. But don't push it. :wink: :rotf:

:rotf: :yakyak: :rotf:

:rotf: :haha: :shake:

I used Goex mostly, but I got a deal on some Swiss, which does foul a little less, and makes the best groups. I tried one can of KIK and like it. To me, Goex is good enough for my tiring eyes, and it's made in the USA.

flintlock62 said:

Goex.... it's made in the USA.

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:hatsoff: