Lyman quality control issues

I am having some pretty serious QC issues with a Lyman trade rifle that I just bought new.I am surprised by the trouble I am having because of all the great reviews I keep hearing and reading on here and in other places as well.Being my first Lyman purchase I am wondering if it is just my luck or if this is a common problem? I recieved the new rifle and when I opened the box I immediately saw that the toe of the stock was split from the back side of the butt plate approx.3" into the stock. I looked the box over and saw no damage of any kind to the Lyman box or the outside shipping packaging so it was obvious that the rifle escaped the factory in this condition.Disappointed,but understanding that these things sometimes happen,I called the company I bought the rifle from and told them about my problem. They said they would be happy to exchange my defective rifle for another but they did not have another one in stock in flint so they recommended that I call Lyman directly.When I called Lyman they directed me to Dixon's which does Lyman's warranty work. I called Dixon's and the gentleman I talked to said to just send the rifle to him and that he would replace the broken stock. I sent the rifle to Dixon's and after only a few days I recieved the rifle back. Upon opening the box I saw that the stock had indeed been replaced with a new one. Now,impressed with how quickly the broken stock issue was resolved,I'm excited so I take the other parts out of the box and begin to assemble the rifle.This is when I find that THE BARREL WILL NOT FIT THE STOCK :cursing: After the barrel was hooked into the tang when you tried to "lay" the barrel into the stock it was not in proper alignment with the barrel channel.The barrel was approx. 1/8"-3/16" off to the left side,in other words the left barrel flat was even with the exterior wood of the forearm and the right side barrel flat had a gap of 1/8" - 3/16" of the barrel channel showing.This,giving the appearance that I was dealing with a "warped" stock had me looking closer for the exact problem. Upon closer inspection I lay the barrel in the barrel channel without hooking the tang and the barrel lays perfectly in the channel,but when you "slide" the barrel back towards the tang I find that the tang is actually inletted off to one side from center of the barrel channel.I then called Dixon's back and this time they told me I need to deal with Lyman directly because they cannot help the quality of the parts that Lyman sends them to use for warranty repairs. This is really making me angry,I now have a new rifle that I purchased,paid thirty bucks to have shipped off for repair,and have burnt ten dollars worth of gas to pick up at FedEX because they wouldn't drop it off without a signature,and I STILL do not have a usable rifle. Is this something that ya'll have seen a lot of before or am I just the chosen one? Now,before anyone says it,I do not expect custom rifle quality from a mass produced model but I do expect to recieve a usable rifle for my money. I am going to call Lyman again today and see what they will do,but this is really getting frustrating. Hopefully they will make it all good,but this is getting expensive and tiresome FAST.I'm done ranting now,if anyone has any input or suggestions please let me know.

Lyman usually has a good rep for handling problems. Call them and fully explain what you have been through already and see what they have too say.

Unless you purchase a fully assembled rifle, you have to realize that you are dealing with a kit. That being said a kit is not a fully assembled rifle and often minor inletting to make for a good final fit is necessary!

It almost sounds if the inlet is off on the hooked breech inlet is off. If it is off enough that moving will leave a gap. Then yes that is a quality control issue and I would not hesitate to let Lyman know. Check thoroughly to see if that is the problem or if it is another issue!

Keep us informed a company is only as good as it's reputation for handling the issues that arise out of their product!

I think that at this point, I would contact the company from whom you bought the rifle and tell them the problems that you have experienced and tell them that you either want another rifle or your money back. That company is not the only place that you can buy a Lyman rifle. I have a Lyman GPR in flint and it is a great rifle so Lyman does make good stuff. You just got a lemon.

Thanks for the input Cliff! I looked it over really close and moving the tang enough to correct this problem will definitely look like $*&#. I understand EXACTLY what you mean about rifles needing some minor inletting out of the box.Every rifle I own has recieved a little TLC in one area or another after purchase but this rifle is not even usable.It would have been alot easier to fix the cracked toe than it would be to fix this stock I have now.In hindsight I should have glued and dowelled the cracked toe on the first stock and installed a toe plate to cover the repair but I didn't feel that I should have to make that extensive of a repair on a new out of the box rifle.I'll let you know what Lyman says and thanks for the input!!

Thanks for the advise,that will be my second course of action if Lyman doesn't make this right. I do understand that any companies QC can slip,but 2 bad stocks in a row is a little hard to swallow.

Update.....I just got off the phone with Lyman customer service and the lady I spoke to was very helpful. After explaining my situation to her she said that she was surprised that I recieved the rifle back from Dixon's in that condition(I was surprised as well) and that I needed to send it to them (Lyman) for repair.She told me to send my rifle with all documentation of the work that was done and the problems I have had. She also said for me to include reciepts for my shipping costs and that they would reimburse me for them.She assured me that my rifle would be "right" when I got it back.I hope this resolves it,and I'll keep ya'll posted. Lyman is one of the last companies that has not turned their back on the traditional MLing industry,I really hope they make it right so I can buy some more of their rifles :grin:

Simple fact is all companys have quality control problems to some degree. But the better companys stand by their product and have good to excellant warrenty service. You can always expect more problems with a kit simply becaquse the parts are not "fit" at the factory where such problems would be detected. :idunno: :idunno:

I would understand completely and would expect this type of issue if I had purchased a kit,but I purchased a complete rifle.Sorry if I wasn't clear enought about that in my orig. post.

It happened but, of course, shouldn't have. With manufactured products and service, 'stuf' happens. I have been in business and it just seems like some customers keep getting the wrong end of the stick. Nobodys fault, just a fact of life and coincidence. Keep after than. Or try to get a refund and then look for a builder to make you a rifle you will be pleased with.

Many years ago I had a small mom and pop gunstore and on 2 different occasions I recieved rifles that had stocks broken exactly as you describe. I seriously doubt that they were shipped that way and I doubt that your was.I think that with all the rough handling that boxes get in shipping they are broken without the box being damaged. I'm sure Lyman will take good care of you as they are a good company that is very interested in their customers satisfaction. FRJ

I done have a Trade Rifle yet, but I have bought 3 GPRs--so far. The only problem I have had was a couple screws were missing from my last one, a kit. I called them and they had it to me in a few days, which was before I needed them as I did an inventory of parts before starting the build and hadn't gotten done finishing the stock before the screws arrived. Based on my experience, you got a lemon, but I still trust Lyman to make it right like they said they would. I know they are a production gun and not a custom, but they're my favorite production ML.

I've got a GPR I bought new and a GPH I bought used. The GPR is sort of a sad-sack and had to go back to Dixon's upon receipt. They fixed most of the initial fit & finish problems and then a few years later, the lock had to go back for repair. It's a great shooter so I live with the cock-eyed trigger guard inletting.

OTOH, fit and finish on the GPH looks fine. Literally nothing to complain about. Same with a Great Plains pistol I bought new later on.

My take is that QC on the Investarms guns sold by Lyman is up and down. Investarms rifles sold by Cablas seem to exhibit more even quality. Perhaps they pay more for them.

Thanks for posting on your Trade Rifle problems. The TR has a reputation for excellent accuracy and I was thinking of trying one...but I hate buying problems.

I recently purchased a Lefty Lyman GPR , from third Generation.Scrubbed the preservative out of the Barrel. Put the Barrel in and the Tenons fit perfect. touch hole was snugged up tight to the Pan, good to go. Shot it ten or so times....Lock stuck in the half cock position. Unscrewed the Lock and had to pry it out of the Mortise. Looked like a Beaver inletted it!!! All whiskered up and a couple small chunks of Wood chipped out. To make a long story short, sent it to Dixon`s and it was returned in short time in excellent working order.It is a frustrating experience but what the heck isn`t anything anymore??????

It doesn't make a big lot of difference if it is a $200 or a $2000 dollar gun. If it is made by the hand of man, it can and probably will fail at some point. It is just easier to point out that the cheap gun is rotten more than the custom gun is. Lyman makes 1000's of guns compared to dozens by high dollar custom makers so the probability of failure is higher, but the percentage may not be. Still either outfit should make it right. Plus the final check list on production guns isn't as whole as it could be but then again it is a LOW cost gun. Custom makers spend what ever time they need to make sure theirs are in good working order.
I have found Lyman CS to be like their guns, good and bad. Hope you's falls into the good column. Good luck!.

Lead Slinger said:

Looked like a Beaver inletted it!!!

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Hey! Beavers have to work somewhere! :haha:

Squirrel Tail,
I bought a Century-built modern rifle many years ago, so was under the impression that the angry drunk beavers worked there, but maybe the sober beavers moved to Lyman. :rotf: On a serious note, like has been said above, everyone of us, just like any company, has and will mess something up. It's just a matter of if and how we fix it. I know I've been very happy with my Lymans, but as still curious how this case works out. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it goes smoothly.

As to the production vs custom route, my only experience so far has been with TVM, and it was right the first time and better than expected. It doesn't shoot any better than my Lymans do, but if you put the two side by side, they aren't even in the same class. My Lymans are great working guns, accurate, and reliable, and I wouldnt hesitate to buy another. But that TVM is a work of art as far as I'm concerned, and that much better because it is an accurate and reliable work of art.

My Lymans are great working guns, accurate, and reliable

Exactly why I bought one. I have a custom .45 built by my late Uncle. I was Hunting with it in the late Pa.Flintlock season. Took a tumble and hit a Log with the Fullstock. Only damage was I knocked the Tenon out a little bit. This Year, I will use the Lyman. I figure it will take a mighty blow to damage it...Hopefully, I won`t find out???

WH.50 said:

I would understand completely and would expect this type of issue if I had purchased a kit,but I purchased a complete rifle.Sorry if I wasn't clear enought about that in my orig. post.

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Now I didn't understand that! I would have been on the war wagon too with that understanding, I thought we were talking kit!!!!!!!!
I am glad that Lyman's is taking care of it though. That is the mark of a good company too handle a problem the right way!

I have several Lymans and all are good shooting rifles. The quality is about what I would expect at that price point. My issues have been more with triggers- some good, some fair.
In the end I don't judge a company on whether I have have a problem. I judge them by how they handle the problem. Even though frustrating, it sounds like Lyman is taking care of it properly. My experience with them has been positive and I would continue to buy their products.

I had the same issues with TC, early guns were close to perfect. The last flinter I bought had a touch hole located in the back corner of the pan, when I pulled the lock for cleaning I found the lock to barrel fit was regulated by 3 blobs of hot melt glue instead of the mortise being inletted properly.

That was my last TC, no more.