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deanscamaro

45 Cal.
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
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Okay all you knife experts out there, I received my new Bowie from my Texas knife supplier yesterday (been wanting one for years). No, I am not one who beats steel into submission to make my knives, but procures the partially finished blades, ready for guard and scales. I want to make it look traditional and am considering the look of ivory scales. With the cost of real mastadon material (pre-restrictions) out there I have to go with synthetic. My question is 1)Are ivory scales H/C? and 2)If so, what modern products are the most "ivory appearing"? I guess I have a third question and that is if not ivory for H/C, what scale material would be the most H/C and recommended? Would appreciate some help on settling my scales decision.
:idunno: :idunno: :v
 
For sure I do not know if Ivory on a Bowie would be HC or not , but a good guess might be some Cavalry officer from the war between the states might have carried one.

A material for knife scales that could well put you where you want to be and be HC is a set of sun bleached Elk ,or Deer antler .

If you were to sand them down smooth and buff them they will give you the look you are after. And you can dye the stress marks them sand and buff to give you that old Ivory look.
Better than plastic ,by far.


Something like this.
DSCF0033.jpg


Or that.

BarlowKnife039.jpg


Twice.
 
Because no one knows if the Original Bowie Knife survives( altho there are two in contention) its generally agreed that the knife was made for fighting, and was NOT ornately decorated. Beyond that premise, just about anything goes. From the Shape, width and length of the blade, to what the guard and handle might look like.

My original Bowie was made with walnut slab handles, held on with brass rod rivets. I later changed the handle to thick Leather, and put a pommel on the back of the handle to better balance the heavy blade. I am quite sure NOW that the leather hand is NOT HC, or even PC. But, that doesn't seem to bother a lot of people looking at my knife!

Without a picture of your blade, I can't know what it looks like, and can't suggest any changes you might want to consider making to the blade.

FWIW, I now believe that most Bowie Knives have blades that are too WIDE to use well as a fighting knife. Most are too short. The Bowie Knife replaced the short sword as the combat weapon gentlemen( and lesser types) carried for self defense. But, it had to be long enough to keep your enemy, armed with a short sword, from cutting your hands and arms to ribbons while remaining beyond your reach, and lunge.

Blades as short a 8-10" simply don't "FEEL" long enough to use in this kind of slash and parry knife fighting- the kind of fighting done in that day. ( 1820s-30s). Blades no wider than 1 1/2" and as long as 15 inches DO "fit" the kind of work they were called on to do, however. We don't know the dimensions of the original Bowie Knife, however. From interviews with Jim Bowie's brother, Rezin, in his later life, Its believed that the original knife had some kind of double guard on it, because Rezin designed the knife after he severely cut his hand on his own knife blade, when it slid forward on to the blade during a thrust. At least, that is the story.

Much of the misinformation about Bowie Knives arises from the English made, "Sheffield" Bowies, made by the thousands, and shipped to the States to sell to the 49er's, who needed a good knife for general work, and for possible fighting. The Bowie was thicker and stiffer than the typical kitchen knife of the day, so the immigrants bought them up as fast as they arrived. But, they were also wider, and shorter to make them more easy to carry in a belt sheath. :hmm:
 
The first Bowie knife was made by myself in the parish of Avoyelles, in this state (Louisiana), as a hunting knife, for which purpose, exclusively, it was used for many years.
Rezin P. Bowie, Planters Advocate: August 24, 1838.

Describing the knife Jim used at the Sandbar fight, Rezin Bowie said, "The length of the blade was nine and one-quarters inches, its width one and one-half inches, single edged and not curved (i.e. no clip aka false edge)" ”¦quite different from the Bowie knife as it came to be recognized

Go here to see more - and be sure and click on the underlined names for pics of the earliest known bowies.. http://www.tamu.edu/ccbn/dewitt/adp/history/bios/bowie/knife_like_bowies.html

The earliest Bowies had single edge blades basically in the shape of what we call a French chef's knife with a dropped edge style blade and no clip. They either had no guard or a single guard like the Searles Bowie made for Rezin, not a double guard.
The clip point style blade with double guard first shows up in the early 1830's and was made as noted from then on in huge quantities by the English, but the American firm of Sheffield Knifeworks, Phila, Penna, was also making clip pointed, double guard Bowies beginning in 1831.

You probably have the latter style blade with clip point and for those PC handle material will depend on where and when made. For English made knives, African Blackwood, Gaboon ebony, Sambar Stag, bone, and horn (mostly black water buffalo from India) and real elephant ivory were very common handle materials. Mastodon ivory was unknown at the time except maybe in Europe. So called pre-ban real elephant Ivory is still available, but is expensive as noted.
On American made Bowies it gets a bit more complicated since you have professional cutler made knives as well as so-called primitives made by local blacksmiths. For these handles run the gamut from the same materials used by the English, along with locall products such as maple, black walnut, hickory, and deer or elk antler.

For the best imitation Ivory check out a product called Tru Ivory. For a similar look to ivory in a natural material, but without the price check out giraffe bone, a very dense bone that works up excellently. For guards the most common of the period is German aka nickle silver with brass coming in a distant second and used more widely on American made period Bowies.

IMO - a suggestion spend the money to get the book The Bowie Knife Unsheathing a Legend by Norm Flayderman. For around $80.00 bucks you get 520 pages of gorgeous color images of real period Bowies as well as a ton of well researched info that helps lay to rest much of the mythology surrounding Bowie and his knife. You amy also be able to get it via your local library.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Thanks to both Paul****** (never could remember how to spell that) and LaBonte for the input. With my limited knowledge of Bowies, I probably didn't buy myself an authentic one, but just one I liked. I am running errands right now and will take a picture and post it later when I have more time. Thanks again!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
 
deano said:
Thanks to both Paul****** (never could remember how to spell that) and LaBonte for the input. With my limited knowledge of Bowies, I probably didn't buy myself an authentic one, but just one I liked. I am running errands right now and will take a picture and post it later when I have more time. Thanks again!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:


That's OK My efforts don't need no thanking.. :hmm: :grin:
Twice.
 
I'm sorry Mr. Boom, I had seen your reply earlier and came back in later and saw the other two. It was not an intended shun.....I sincerely apologize for the slight.
:surrender: :bow: :redface:
 
deano said:
I'm sorry Mr. Boom, I had seen your reply earlier and came back in later and saw the other two. It was not an intended shun.....I sincerely apologize for the slight.
:surrender: :bow: :redface:

Just having little fun on a slow day.
No slight taken.. Seriously..
Hurry with the pictures.
twice
 
Okay, here is the raw Bowie. I am open to any and all criticizm (whether it is an authentic shape or not) on my selection in the hopes of gaining knowledge. I just personally like the profile. Still looking for any suggestions, in addition to those I already have from Paul********, Mr. LaBonte and especially Mr. Boom. I think it is going to take a heavy looking set of scales to balance that blade.
:bow: :bow: :bow:

RawBowie-1.jpg
 
THe nice thing about it not being HC/PC is that you can do whatever you want. I have a Western Bowie, made in Boulder, CO (not made there anymore) that had a broken handle, and the guard was steel. I got a funky brass guard and some spalted maple for scales, and I caryy it when I'm in the mountains.
That one of yours would look good with antler or wood, or whatever.
Have fun.
 
If it was made in Boulder and they are no longer in business, its not surprising, knowing the people in Boulder (I can say that because I lived there for 10 years). Ha! Ha! :rotf: :rotf:

Thanks, Mr Boom, I like it too.
 
I see that baby dressed with Cap Buffalo horn with blond streaks running through it.Oh,yeaaaaa. :wink:

012307knives003-1.jpg
 
Well, the dye has been cast. I see that "Bowie Baby" dressed in desert ironwood.

DesertIronwood.jpg


I have a cousin who is in love with the wood and recommended it. I found I had a supplier within 20 minutes of my house, trolled over there and picked up these scales. I think the color, grain design and even name "Desert Ironwood" fits the knife. These scales are too pretty to even start working with, but I will have to overcome that hurdle.
:grin: :grin: :grin:
 
deano said:
Well, the dye has been cast. I see that "Bowie Baby" dressed in desert ironwood.

DesertIronwood.jpg


I have a cousin who is in love with the wood and recommended it. I found I had a supplier within 20 minutes of my house, trolled over there and picked up these scales. I think the color, grain design and even name "Desert Ironwood" fits the knife. These scales are too pretty to even start working with, but I will have to overcome that hurdle.
:grin: :grin: :grin:

Now that's class,I agree..

What are you thinking for a sheath. Something in tooled Black leather and siver tipped ? Might as well go all out for that babe. :wink:
Twice.
 
You are thinking just what I am about a sheath....it has to be something dark with some studs of some kind. Heavy, dark and metal would go great with it.
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
 
A note of caution when working with desert ironwood - the dust can be HIGHLY damaging to the upper respiratory system - it can and will cause a fungus in the lungs that is not good for ones health and as far as I know is incurable. Be sure and use a good mask and clean up your clothing, etc. of all dust afterwards. Use good sense and plenty of ventilation and things will be fine, but more than a few custom knifemakers have found out the hard way about the toxicity of this beautiful wood.
 
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