00 buck legal in the New England state of NH for deer nothing bigger. such as bear or moose.
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Buckshot
- Thread starter Gun Tramp
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I increased the powder charge to 60 grains Fg for the components shown in post #1 of this thread and shot these two targets:
Nine and ten pellets on the paper versus eleven when using 50 grains of Fg as in post #1.
Nine and ten pellets on the paper versus eleven when using 50 grains of Fg as in post #1.
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Twenty-five #4 buckshot from a Lee mould weighed 1 1/4 oz.
Try as I might, I could not get more than one of the multiple cavities to fill per pour. Just unable to get the mould hot enough and the result was a cute little tail on every pellet. These are pure lead; trying an alloy made no difference. But they shot pretty good:
From fifty feet, sixteen made it to where they belonged. Several holes show the tails sideways. 50 grains Fg.
Try as I might, I could not get more than one of the multiple cavities to fill per pour. Just unable to get the mould hot enough and the result was a cute little tail on every pellet. These are pure lead; trying an alloy made no difference. But they shot pretty good:
From fifty feet, sixteen made it to where they belonged. Several holes show the tails sideways. 50 grains Fg.
Good general purpose small game pot shot load sir. Nothing filled with shot and what kills it passed through
When I lived in NJ buckshot was the only legal round for deer and bear. They noe allow slugs, thank goodness. I am content with my 20 gauge fowler. Much past 50 yards you couldn't see an elephant, let alone a deer.
00 buck is legal for deer in NH when using a muzzleloader?
I'm sure glad 00 buckshot is legal in NC because I have killed at least 20 deer or more with it up to 50 yards throughout my life. I do not shoot at "moving bushes" either. I always take a good look at the deer, make sure it is not a fawn, make sure I know where my hunting party is located, then-only then take the shot. And only one of these deer, was taken with my 12 gauge extra-full jug choked unmentionable muzzle loader, last season. And the rest were all taken with an extra-full choked 870 and even a full-choked single barrel 20 gauge. I love 00 buckshot and will be developing a load for each barrel of my new Pedersoli side by side this coming week. My first buck was at the age of 11 years old with the 20 gauge Ivory Johnson , my brother and dad, and our only beagle at the time Goofy. Sorry for mentioning 3 unmentionables guys.
You will know when you hit the limit. Believe first offense is a reprimand. Second results in a deletion. Go for it, live on the edge......
I fixed the trigger issue today properly with my side by side after it messed up my hunt. I just replace the pin with a lot longer one. Thanks for the help again.
I did that with my .69 cal.
Birdshot bounced back with too weak a charge. Still got both eyes. Painful lesson learned and smile when I think about it now, years later.
Hawk78,
I take head shots with my Pedersoli 10 ga. Inside 40 yards it kills! Pigs and deer.
Do not know if you own the 10 ga but this is what I use.
I use leather over powder wads. (Much better than the hard card wads) Better consistent velocity.
110 grains OE 2Fg. 1 hard leather OP wad. 1/8" to 1/4". 1 1/2" felt lubed with bore butter. 1 3/8 oz. to 1 1/2 oz. Nickle Plated buck your size. (I buy this from Ballistic Products or Precision Reloading) and then finally 1 1/2" lubed felt to top it off. DEADLY. The Nickle Plated buck holds together better than standard buck shot. In my gun this load averages 1120 FPS with the 1 3/8 oz. load and 1105 FPS with the 1 1/2 oz. load. Good Hunting.
I take head shots with my Pedersoli 10 ga. Inside 40 yards it kills! Pigs and deer.
Do not know if you own the 10 ga but this is what I use.
I use leather over powder wads. (Much better than the hard card wads) Better consistent velocity.
110 grains OE 2Fg. 1 hard leather OP wad. 1/8" to 1/4". 1 1/2" felt lubed with bore butter. 1 3/8 oz. to 1 1/2 oz. Nickle Plated buck your size. (I buy this from Ballistic Products or Precision Reloading) and then finally 1 1/2" lubed felt to top it off. DEADLY. The Nickle Plated buck holds together better than standard buck shot. In my gun this load averages 1120 FPS with the 1 3/8 oz. load and 1105 FPS with the 1 1/2 oz. load. Good Hunting.
Thank you sir for this information. What size buckshot do you use?
Hawk78,
I typically use 00 or 000 buck. Nickle makes a big difference. Now most of the shots I have in thick cover are <35 yrds.
I typically use 00 or 000 buck. Nickle makes a big difference. Now most of the shots I have in thick cover are <35 yrds.
Is your shot hand cast with flat sprue, or are they swaged?
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Swaged. I should add that my loads in this thread would only be suitable for small game; note the modest powder charges.
Yes, i noted the small powder charges.
I'm looking some nickel plated 00 buckshot online, wish me luck friend.
I’ve had good luck ordering swaged buckshot from Ballistic Products, although I’ve not ordered any of the nickel plated. See the 00 is out of stock right now, so of little help at the moment. Nickel-Plated lead buckshot #00 8.6mm (11#)-ballisticproducts.com
megasupermagnum
45 Cal.
Unfortunately there are many misconceptions, and many variables with buckshot. Used within its limits, nothing can beat it. If a slug is just as effective... well you probably weren't a very good shotgun shooter to begin with. Buckshot is shot. It is best used with a shotgun with no sights, and is best used in situations with moving targets and or thick cover. Now I'm not advocating shooting sprinting deer, but in the best spots deer rarely stop. Same with thick cover. If you can't see the eyeballs, then you can't positively identify the target. But if you do find yourself in a swamp, or creek bottom with downed trees and brush in every direction, and a deer comes trotting along at a good pace, then buckshot is the best tool for the job. It is not the tool for sitting on the edge of a corn field. It's my opinion that most people do not hunt the heaviest of cover, so most do not understand.
Patterning buckshot is just like shot. You want multiple pellets in the vitals of your deer. I do not advocate head shots, but I do like the idea of the base of the neck, same as shooting turkey. With an adequate pattern you are sure to get some in the neck, some in the lungs, and a good chance of hitting something big enough to drop the animal on the spot. The traditional lung shot works too. I think where people run into trouble is from not patterning their gun, taking a long shot, and only getting a single pellet through the lungs. This wouldn't be good. Put 3-4 pellets in the lungs, and that deer won't be far at all, probably closer than a normal rifle shot.
Since this forum does claim to ban firearms inventions post 1865, I'm not sure I should talk about choke. I do see a lot of mention of jug chokes on this forum though. I'll simply say that choke can have a monumental difference in the tightness of your pattern. Assuming a cylinder bore, you are far more limited. Even with that, the old 1" per yard rule, just throw that out the window. Even in modern shotguns, a poor load could be twice that, and a good load can pattern WAY tighter. Looking at your picture, that's a spread about 12", and you say that is 17 yards. That is not a horrible pattern, but you can tighten that if you wish. There are a ton of variables in your load to mess with.
The shot quality is one easy area. Soft lead makes horrible buckshot. The basic swaged antimony buckshot is ok, but not the best. Some hard swaged shot, like from Ballistic products is pretty good. The very finest buckshot that you can get can only be made. Clip on wheel weights is an ideal alloy, something semi-hard, ideally with some arsenic in it. The key is to drop the shot straight out of the mold into a bucket of ice water. Cold tap water works nearly as well. Alternatively you can oven heat treat the shot later. Doing this significantly hardens the shot, without sacrificing weight, or making them brittle. For example, pure lead is about 5 BHN, swaged buckshot about 12 BHN, BPI super buck about 15 BHN, and heat treated cast shot can be 25 to over 30 BHN. The harder they are, the rounder they stay during firing. Round shot flies straighter.
Buffer is one area I don't see messed with too often in muzzleloaders. Something like cream of wheat should work better than modern plastic buffers with regards to fouling. The trick I've found is to pour your powder in, and ram your over powder wads down first. Then only start another wad, a thin overshot card works well, start it only 3" or so into the barrel. Then you can drop your shot in, making sure it stacks properly. At this point you can pour in buffer, while lightly tapping the barrel, until the shot is covered. You want the buffer in the gaps between the shot, not mixed in, and not underneath. Gentle taps on the side, not on the butt of the gun. Finally add overshot, and ram down fully.
Speaking of stacking, shot size can make a difference. Some stack better than others. I often find stacks of 2's work great. To find, simply divide your bore diameter by 2. In your case, assuming your bore diameter is .690", balls .345" will stack in 2's. I find you can often go slightly larger than this, and get them to stack with minimal "encouragement" with your ramrod.
Patterning buckshot is just like shot. You want multiple pellets in the vitals of your deer. I do not advocate head shots, but I do like the idea of the base of the neck, same as shooting turkey. With an adequate pattern you are sure to get some in the neck, some in the lungs, and a good chance of hitting something big enough to drop the animal on the spot. The traditional lung shot works too. I think where people run into trouble is from not patterning their gun, taking a long shot, and only getting a single pellet through the lungs. This wouldn't be good. Put 3-4 pellets in the lungs, and that deer won't be far at all, probably closer than a normal rifle shot.
Since this forum does claim to ban firearms inventions post 1865, I'm not sure I should talk about choke. I do see a lot of mention of jug chokes on this forum though. I'll simply say that choke can have a monumental difference in the tightness of your pattern. Assuming a cylinder bore, you are far more limited. Even with that, the old 1" per yard rule, just throw that out the window. Even in modern shotguns, a poor load could be twice that, and a good load can pattern WAY tighter. Looking at your picture, that's a spread about 12", and you say that is 17 yards. That is not a horrible pattern, but you can tighten that if you wish. There are a ton of variables in your load to mess with.
The shot quality is one easy area. Soft lead makes horrible buckshot. The basic swaged antimony buckshot is ok, but not the best. Some hard swaged shot, like from Ballistic products is pretty good. The very finest buckshot that you can get can only be made. Clip on wheel weights is an ideal alloy, something semi-hard, ideally with some arsenic in it. The key is to drop the shot straight out of the mold into a bucket of ice water. Cold tap water works nearly as well. Alternatively you can oven heat treat the shot later. Doing this significantly hardens the shot, without sacrificing weight, or making them brittle. For example, pure lead is about 5 BHN, swaged buckshot about 12 BHN, BPI super buck about 15 BHN, and heat treated cast shot can be 25 to over 30 BHN. The harder they are, the rounder they stay during firing. Round shot flies straighter.
Buffer is one area I don't see messed with too often in muzzleloaders. Something like cream of wheat should work better than modern plastic buffers with regards to fouling. The trick I've found is to pour your powder in, and ram your over powder wads down first. Then only start another wad, a thin overshot card works well, start it only 3" or so into the barrel. Then you can drop your shot in, making sure it stacks properly. At this point you can pour in buffer, while lightly tapping the barrel, until the shot is covered. You want the buffer in the gaps between the shot, not mixed in, and not underneath. Gentle taps on the side, not on the butt of the gun. Finally add overshot, and ram down fully.
Speaking of stacking, shot size can make a difference. Some stack better than others. I often find stacks of 2's work great. To find, simply divide your bore diameter by 2. In your case, assuming your bore diameter is .690", balls .345" will stack in 2's. I find you can often go slightly larger than this, and get them to stack with minimal "encouragement" with your ramrod.
