Brass frame revolver wear

RB POWELL said:

And, there is a historical factor that adds to the charm.

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If you are speaking about ACW Confederate Colt "type" revolvers, only Schneider & Glassick and Griswold & Gunnison made "brass" frames. The original G&G frames were actually termed "gunmetal" which had a much higher copper content than, say, a G&G made by Pietta today, which accounts for the reddish color of the original G&G frames. S&G made very few of these with full octagon barrels, but G&G made over 3600 specimens, which all had part round/part octagon barrels and smooth/plain non-engraved cylinders.

Two of my Confederate replicas: Pietta G&G and Pietta Rigdon & Ansley (with a 12-stop-slot cylinder I had milled by my machinist neighbor: a non-factory-produced revolver I created using a Pietta 1851 Navy with Pietta parts).



IMO, and in the opinions of many others, brass frames do not "stretch". The problem of cylinder end play when using very warm loads is caused by the cylinder ratchet being repeatedly slammed into the brass ring around the arbor in the recoil shield, which gets imprinted in that area. At half cock there is no cylinder end play, but at hammer down and at full cock it is apparent. I don't shoot my G&G nor my S&G. I will stick to my steel frame Leech & Rigdon, Rigdon & Ansley, and Augusta Machine Works revolvers, all Pietta replicas I created from 1851 Navy revolvers using Pietta .

Regards,

Jim

I have had a .36 caliber Spiller and Burr replica for about 10 years. I have only used mild loads of black powder in it with round balls, and have never had any problems with stretching or anything else.

The gun shot way high when I bought it, so I pulled out the original sight and made a longer one out of an old brass screw.

I made the holster for it.

I have replaced cyl pins on both brass and steel framed revolvers. it is my opininion pins on brass tend to loosen much, much faster.

Desperate Lee said:

Guys i will say this so all can hear me, IF YOU ARE WORRIED ABOUT YOUR BRASS FRAME REVOLVERS THEN BOX THEM UP, PM ME, THEN SHIP THEM TO ME AND I WILL DISPOSE OF THEM FOR YOU AT NO CHARGE! That way the burden is removed from you and you can rest at night in peace and comfort.
DL

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Send me your steel framed revolvers and you won't have to worry about THEM! Thank you for your profound, insightful addition to our conversation. -J.A.

Treestalker said:

Send me your steel framed revolvers and you won't have to worry about THEM! Thank you for your profound, insightful addition to our conversation. -J.A.

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come on the guy was just funning. ease up francis

Some very early brass frames do not have a steel cross pin retaining the cyl pin. The pin both spreads the load and prevent turning. I have see ones made during the black power craze of the 80's with only a pressed in pin. Adding a pin and taking it easy on powder and loading lever use may greatly extend their use. IIRC some of these had difficulty keeping the loading lever engaged when shooting. It would just drop at each shot.

Being a home machinist and Hobbyist gun mechanic I have been gun show looking for a loose brass revolver to test some ideas on as to making shooters out of them again. My thinking is to machine a steel arbor threaded bushing and sweat it into the recoil shield/standing breech with low temp silver solder. I don't think the brass revolvers actually stretch but rather thread loosen and peen back on the recoil shield, raised ring which is what increases the tolerances. My guess is that much of this (thread loosening) could be mitigated as well by loading the cylinder out of the gun on a press. The act of loading with the seating ram puts a lot of non linear, unsupported tangent-al stress on the arbor threads which is what is the real culprit in loosening them where as shooting stress is supported by the lower barrel bridge causing the thread pull to be linear and in parallel with the bore.
I have never cared for the under size chambers in relation to barrel groove depth on most Pietta's and some other reproduction revolvers. I line bored mine out to .450 on an early 58 Pietta and feel it is actually accuracy superior to a very good Ruger Old Army I also have. Both guns have had the triggers worked over but the Pietta has been fire lapped and the forcing cone recut as well. I think any Pietta has the making of a very accurate revolver when tuned up to full potential.

I think both placing an insert and pinning would be the best. Obtaining maximum shear strength and resistance to peening or twist is the idea. I was going to bring up the issue of loading lever stress tending to pull pin out frame but last time i did i got criticized on another forum hwo knew little of metallurgy and force transmission. Colt design clearly demonstrates leverage gained by the loading lever is placed directly on the pin as do firing forces. All in all, brass frames both in originals and repros were never intended for prolonged use.

vintovka said:

Some very early brass frames do not have a steel cross pin retaining the cyl pin. The pin both spreads the load and prevent turning. I have see ones made during the black power craze of the 80's with only a pressed in pin. Adding a pin and taking it easy on powder and loading lever use may greatly extend their use. IIRC some of these had difficulty keeping the loading lever engaged when shooting. It would just drop at each shot.

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Vintovka, Thank you for your informative and insightful reply. I have seen C&B revolvers with screwed in arbors and no pin, but not pressed with no pin. I remember some earlier makes that left a lot to be desired, and a couple down right dangerous. Have not seen the loading lever problem except on a Walker. I'm trying to encourage exchange of ideas, long term loading success and learn ways to fabricate improvements to the brass framed guns for my own and others' benefit. Thanks again, George.

Just slightly before and/or during the early BP craze Sarco was offering lots of new 51 repops, Price was like 29.95 but not higher than 35 per. Less in lots. I think these were ones with no pins and "falling levers". May even have been made in spain.

If you visit some of the larger online firearms auctions you may see many used brass frame parts lots/kits offered. You rarely see steel frame ones.