Loading anxiety.

I understand your anxiety, and share it to an extent. I always run a damp patch down the bore between shots.

Well, I think swabbing might just be the ticket I needed. I really appreciate every bit of information given here, learned a lot more than I expected! Thanks again.

I didn't do any swabbing prior to this and just put together a kit in my muzzleloader shooting bag for the next outing. I received a bunch of different cast bullets for my P53 from an N-SSA member earlier this week, and this will be a good opportunity to add this to my loading process as I run them down range.

I don't plan on doing speed shooting in any sense of the matter, N-SSA isn't a thing where I live, and i'm mostly interested in seeing how far I can go to ring a steel plate at range. So adding this step will more or less be in line with the way I normally shoot anyway.

I'll certainly be looking into putting together some of that MAP stuff as I go along.

Thanks!

Smokestack said:

Feel free to point and laugh here, but I'm hoping to get some input regarding an issue I have with shooting muzzleloaders.

I've got a bad habit of expecting the worst with things, and i've heard a horror story too many of muskets going off from an ember in the chamber while loading. I usually space my shots out five or so minutes apart but sometimes I wonder if I'm just taking it a little too far.

I know a lot of you folks here have been shooting the things for years without issue, I'm curious as to what your methods are as to load and shoot your muzzleloaders safely.

Click to expand...

The first thing I do between shots I'd to run a wet patch down the barrel. It cleans the slightest fouling and extinguishes anything that might be in the barrel. It also makes some time without being too scared. Next I run a dry patch, last I load my powder charge and lubed patched ball. I have a mark on the ramrod that tells me I'm home. No need to go animal on the rod. The sized lubed patch makes loading the ball easy. Then I prime the pan at half cock, close the frizzen and set up my shot. When I'm relaxed and my breathing has regulated then I pull the hammer to full cock. Nobody will laugh at you for asking a question regarding safety. Once upon a time, I asked the same question and that was the answer I was given. I've never had an accident with a black powder gun and the guy who taught me, never had an accident with his. My way isn't the only way. It works for me. It'll work for you.
Neil

dave951 said:

Uhmm ok, please explain the use of a thumbstall and why soldiers were drilled to leave the cap on the musket when reloading minies. Maybe they knew something then we've almost forgotten?

Click to expand...

I assume to prevent accidental discharge, you know, "going off half cocked", or to prevent accidental discharge from sparks from other shooters in close formation when you are reloading.

Guys, it's obvious most of you are PRB guys and for PRB, I'm ok with wiping. Come on over to minies, the last major development in muzzleloading, and things are a tad different.

If you are loading and firing at a target shooting pace, the chance of any kind of cook-off is negligable. I have never wiped between shots. I suspect that unless you are capable of shooting a caliber-szed hole at 50 yards, it doesnt make a differece unless you allow your gun to foul to a silly amount, and you can't get the ball down all the way. As soon as i notice the ball is sticking at the bottom, i get a really wet swabbing patch and swab out the bore above the load. No danger of wetting the load beyond the patched ball. For the next couple of shots, i use extra-wet patches to clean the area wher the ball sits when loaded. Always remember; dont put anything you really want to take home with you over the muzzle while doing any of this.

dave951 said:

Come on over to minies, the last major development in muzzleloading,

Click to expand...

Been there, round balls just kept calling my name.

The subject reminded me of this video I saw years ago, demonstrating "tap loading".

I have never done this myself and would not recommend it — especially priming the pan BEFORE the main charge. But the demonstration DOES show that even with very rapid firing and reloading, there were no burning embers and NO cook-offs.

dave951 said:

Guys, it's obvious most of you are PRB guys and for PRB, I'm ok with wiping. Come on over to minies, the last major development in muzzleloading, and things are a tad different.

Click to expand...

Many reason I’m not a fan of minies. One is cost, they use FAR more lead than even a .58 round ball. Store bought minies are a crapshoot and may work very poorly, but all are very expensive (about $0.50 per on up). So economically they are much worse than a round ball, especially smaller calibers. And I have NEVER seen a Minie rifle outshoot a patched round ball rifle both worked up. I’ve HEARD it, but have never SEEN it. Simply put, in MY experience, a PRB is far easier to get excellent accuracy with than a Minie. No sizing bullets, tricky casting, etc.

Not only that but Minie rifles are military rifles. The military guns, while cool, lack the individual character and beauty of so many civilian made rifles of the period. A ‘61 Springer or a ‘53 Enfield are neat guns, but they don’t touch a finely carved decorated slender American longrifle.

Yes, you are over thinking this.

2 guys are out in the desert and one gets bit in the crotch by a rattler. Guy bit says call Doc and see what to do. 2cnd guy calls and Doc says 'suck out the poison.' Guy bit says 'what'd he say?' 2cnd guy says 'You're gonna die.'

I feel for you, Smokestack. The idea of shooting a muzzleloader being anything other than relaxing hurts my heart. I think maybe you need to trust yourself more. It's a very simple type of shooting to do safely if you take your time and don't get rushed. I believe the majority of mishaps (I won't call them accidents) with muzzleloaders are the fault of a rushed or inexperienced shooter doing something ill advised. It really is a rather safe sport otherwise if you take simple precautions.

I personally don't shoot fast as that would be the opposite of fun for me. I do remove my spent caps, go to half-cock to clear the nipple and blow down the barrel to burn up any lingering embers. I used pre-lubed patches for convenience, but am just as happy with spit-lubed patches. I feel no need to swab between shots. After I load I make sure my powder flask is far from where any spark from the next shot can reach it. If shooting cap and ball pistols I make sure to use well fitting caps to prevent chain fires. I scrub out my barrels with soap and water after each shooting session so I don't have combustible crud building up inside.

Most importantly, I concentrate on only what I am doing, which also helps me forget the worries of the outside world. I turn my phone off. Even though I am a professional photographer, I've never tried to photograph myself shooting. The resulting connection to this old fashioned sport and it's associated traditions help to put me in a frame of mind a friend once described as finding Zen. And I take some small pride in my middling skills with my rifle, as well as in my ability to practice this sport called muzzleloading with some level of competence and safety.

I hope you find your Zen. And avoid getting a powder burn tattoo while you are at it.

Smokey Plainsman said:

Many reason I’m not a fan of minies. One is cost, they use FAR more lead than even a .58 round ball. Store bought minies are a crapshoot and may work very poorly, but all are very expensive (about $0.50 per on up)..

Click to expand...

Anybody serious about shooting minies doesn't buy them. It's a custom proposition and I dare say somebody who knows how to get a minie rifle to shoot well is far better acquainted with their rifle than the average PRB shooter.

Smokey Plainsman said:

One is cost, they use FAR more lead than even a .58 round ball........... So economically they are much worse than a round ball, especially smaller calibers.

Click to expand...

Same reason we don't all drive a Prius or Yugo. Some folks just like a truck.

Smokey Plainsman said:

And I have NEVER seen a Minie rifle outshoot a patched round ball rifle both worked up. I’ve HEARD it, but have never SEEN it. Simply put, in MY experience, a PRB is far easier to get excellent accuracy with than a Minie. No sizing bullets, tricky casting, etc.

Click to expand...

You obviously have never been to a N-SSA National shoot. I've scored 100yd targets where the score was 99 8x offhand with minies.

Smokey Plainsman said:

Not only that but Minie rifles are military rifles. The military guns, while cool, lack the individual character and beauty of so many civilian made rifles of the period. A ‘61 Springer or a ‘53 Enfield are neat guns, but they don’t touch a finely carved decorated slender American longrifle.

Click to expand...

Sorta agree here, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I like a good military rifle as much as a finely crafted longrifle. But if the chips are down, the beauty queen isn't the tool for the job.

As a military man myself, military rifles and their utilitarian nature appeal to me in the fact that they're built to take abuse. Heavy duty, big super strong lock, beefy stock, and practical idiot proof furniture... I give my original 1842 Harper's Ferry the same googly eyes I give my Allen Martin Lancaster when I walk into the shop... They're like the ladies. Rugged or dainty, there's almost always something to admire.

Smokestack said:

Feel free to point and laugh here, but I'm hoping to get some input regarding an issue I have with shooting muzzleloaders.

I've got a bad habit of expecting the worst with things, and i've heard a horror story too many of muskets going off from an ember in the chamber while loading. I usually space my shots out five or so minutes apart but sometimes I wonder if I'm just taking it a little too far.

I know a lot of you folks here have been shooting the things for years without issue, I'm curious as to what your methods are as to load and shoot your muzzleloaders safely.

Click to expand...

If you pour powder on top of an ember (1 in 1,000,000) you will not be burned unless your face is over the muzzle. There are only four steadfast rules about loading a muzzleloader. 1. NEVER put your face over the muzzle. 2. Never cap a loaded rifle at a range until you are ready to shoot and you are on the firing line. 3. Once loaded, treat the rifle as a loaded ready to fire rifle even if it doesn't go off when you pull the trigger. And 4. Close or cap your horn or powder container after you pour your powder.

My guns, Manton 1808, and Westley Richards 1812, have Knock breaches and ante-chambers - how do you swab out the ante chamfer?

Carbon 6 said:

There is an easy solution for your anxiety, it's called swabbing between shots.
You'll never see a cannoneer reload without swabbing.

Click to expand...

Exactly what I was going to suggest. I’ve never experienced a burning ember.... but just to make double sure, I swab..it’s not a bad habit to get Into actually. Once down all the way with a lightly dampened patch of spit or cleaner and then straight out. Do it after every shot and you’ll snuff the embers out ... while cleaning your bore. I’ve swabbed ever since I’ve started shooting BP. Just my 2 cents..

Crow-Feather said:

If you pour powder on top of an ember (1 in 1,000,000) you will not be burned unless your face is over the muzzle. There are only four steadfast rules about loading a muzzleloader. 1. NEVER put your face over the muzzle. 2. Never cap a loaded rifle at a range until you are ready to shoot and you are on the firing line. 3. Once loaded, treat the rifle as a loaded ready to fire rifle even if it doesn't go off when you pull the trigger. And 4. Close or cap your horn or powder container after you pour your powder.

Click to expand...

I think what the OP is bothered by.. is this scenerio; so I’ve just shot my rifle, I go to reload, pouring my powder in from my measure... then I add patch and ball on top. What IF the powder ignites while I’m compressing the ball down the barrel?IF this was to happen a very ugly injury could occur.. Its a very unlikely scenerio...but I’ve seen more unlikely stuff happen in my life than that.

S.Kenton said:

I think what the OP is bothered by.. is this scenerio; so I’ve just shot my rifle, I go to reload, pouring my powder in from my measure... then I add patch and ball on top. What IF the powder ignites while I’m compressing the ball down the barrel?IF this was to happen a very ugly injury could occur.. Its a very unlikely scenerio...but I’ve seen more unlikely stuff happen in my life than that.

Click to expand...

I get it, but if you pour a scoop of black powder upon an ember it WILL NOT wait for you to load your patched ball to make itself known... I Promisio.

mathews186 said:

My guns, Manton 1808, and Westley Richards 1812, have Knock breaches and ante-chambers - how do you swab out the ante chamber?

Click to expand...

With a big squirt of alcohol or M.A.P.