Afraid of ghost?

The same questions you pose about ghosts are also posed about human souls. If you believe in human souls, have you or anyone else ever tried to take a picture of them when they leave the body at death? (Actually some folks have tried to do this and always failed.)

There are also those who don't believe animals have souls. Many, if not most Native Americans at least used to believe that Spirit Helpers manifest/ed themselves as animals and thus would be "animal ghosts."

There are also those who believe ghosts are manifested out of the untapped 90 percent capability of the human mind and especially before puberty.

Gus

I find it stunning that 'educated' citizens of what purports to be the most advanced nation on earth believe in ghosts in the 21st century. The war between reason/knowledge and superstition/ignorance is over, and reason/knowledge lost.

Spence

I find it stunning that as advanced as modern science is, there is still so much we do not know. Worse still, there is much that is considered "science" that can not be proven by science.

Gus

Is it possible for the things you believe to exist outside of the human mind ?

I find it stunning that as advanced as modern science is, there is still so much we do not know.

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But consider what we have learned...... :hmm:

The scientists I trust most are those who often say, "We just don't know for certain, but here is what we BELIEVE is the cause or reason...., but we may be completely wrong."

Gus

"We just don't know for certain, but here is what we BELIEVE is the cause or reason...., but we may be completely wrong."

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Pseudoscience.....

I would simply say, this is what we have learned or discovered...

The moment a scientist stops asking questions, starts making assumptions and begins apologizing....(as in your scenario) ....He/she is no longer a credible scientist.

The scientists I trust most are those who often say

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The sad reality is that....almost no one gets their information directly from scientists..

People get their information from second hand sources that very often don't understand the science or they put their own political, economic, or religious spin on it.

Trust the science, but be cautious of the messenger.. :v

Well, even the science can not be trusted when it is jumbled by those who have come to believe in science as more of a cult or religion, than what can be proved - even as little as we can prove some things.

Gus

colorado clyde said:

Is it possible for the things you believe to exist outside of the human mind ?

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Well, because you asked a very general question, then my very general answer is "Of course."

Gus

Artificer said:

Well, most every Christian denomination I know of believes in at least one Ghost.
Gus

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Gus,
I ain't never seen that one either,and I've been in lots of places He is supposed
to hang out. :hmm:
snake-eyes :hatsoff:

Well, even the science can not be trusted when it is jumbled by those who have come to believe in science as more of a cult or religion, than what can be proved - even as little as we can prove some things.

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I assume you are referring to research done by Dr. Ian Stevenson at the Division of Perceptual Studies (DOPS) at the University of Virginia’s School of Medicine.

Artificer said:

colorado clyde said:

Is it possible for the things you believe to exist outside of the human mind ?

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Well, because you asked a very general question, then my very general answer is "Of course."

Gus

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Time spent with an Alzheimer's patient might change your opinion.

I'm under the impression most re-enactors would love to see ghosts around a place like that. I sure would.

colorado clyde said:

Artificer said:

colorado clyde said:

Is it possible for the things you believe to exist outside of the human mind ?

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Well, because you asked a very general question, then my very general answer is "Of course."

Gus

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Time spent with an Alzheimer's patient might change your opinion.

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OK, so you went from an extremely general question to a much more specific topic.

My Paternal Grandfather was in the beginning stages of Alzheimer's when he passed at age 96 in 1988. My Uncle by marriage had full blown Alzheimer's in his 80's before he passed. Alzheimer's is a truly tragic disease.

Please understand I am not trying to be critical of you, but I had no way of reading your mind and still do not quite understand the point you are trying to make by using Alzheimer's in this discussion.

Gus

colorado clyde said:

Well, even the science can not be trusted when it is jumbled by those who have come to believe in science as more of a cult or religion, than what can be proved - even as little as we can prove some things.

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I assume you are referring to research done by Dr. Ian Stevenson at the Division of Perceptual Studies (DOPS) at the University of Virginia’s School of Medicine.

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Actually, I wasn't. Again, not to be critical in any way, but I did not really understand what you were referring to earlier, because of the generality of your question.

Gus

Well, nice discussion Gus.....but I think we have sheered all the wool off this sheep.... :haha: :surrender:

I will not say that I believe in "ghosts" as we define them, but I do believe that there are things, forces, occurrences that are very real, but go without rational explanation or understanding. I have experienced three such encounters myself, causing me to have an open mind on such matters. Two were only audible, but one was very physical and completely unexplainable. While standing and working alone on a knife blade at a work bench, I received a very forceful blow to my left shoulder and breast area that spun me around nearly knocking me to the floor. There was no one there but me! This happened in an old large open building that offered no where for an assailant to have hidden, or retreat to, save one small rest room which I immediately checked, and yet, no one, or anything was ever visible, and was completely silent, during the occurrence, and after. If a person did this, there is absolutely no way I would have not seen him. I gathered what little composure I could muster, and left the building for that day. This happened at about mid day during a rain storm, but the building had a spacious sky light allowing very good visibility. I worked in that same building for over two years after that, but never had anything else of that nature happen there again. I have relived that happening many times, but it remains a complete mystery that I have no answer for. An invisible force from no where that nearly floored a 200lb man.

Wick,

Was there lightening that day along with the rain? Sounds like it may have been caused by the effects of an indirect lightening strike?

Gus

I would just like to speak up for modern science, the way it is supposed to be practiced lays down no absolutes. Any theory can and has been questioned, and can continue to be questioned in the future. There is no such thing as set-in-stone science.

If anyone thinks they can call on science to disprove all this metaphysical stuff offhand, they should go talk to a cutting edge quantum physicist. I think they would find reality as we recognize it is still not quite figured out, not even close. When they start delving into a lot of scientific assumptions we assume to be fact, they find they don't hold up any better than the assumption that the Earth is flat, or the center of the Universe.