How many barrel tennons?

I'm building a PA rifle with a 38" barrel. How many tennons/pins would be appropriate? I'm guessing 3 with this shorter barrel but have to admit that I'm a bit nervous about cutting the dovetails in the middle where the swamped barrel is thinner. Any thoughts or advice?

For what it's worth, I've only cut my own tennons once before. It went well but you know......

Most use three on a 38" barrel. A lot of guys solder the center lug. If you do dovetail it keep it shallow.

I've done it both ways, but I'm more inclined to solder them now. No chance of cutting too deep.

Greg

Thanks Greg. When you say that you solder them, do you inlet a dovetail about half depth or do you solder right to the outside of the barrel? Using the same tenons as you do for the inlet ones or one with a shallower base?

I did go out and measure where I want my entry thimble, my ramrod pipes, my muzzle cap and all 3 pins but I also discovered that I stupidly forgot to get tenons when I ordered my other supplies. I don't have any bar stock or any real inclination to make my own so I'll go ahead and order them but I don't want to get the wrong thing.

Thanks for your advice, it's appreciated.

Get Tracks UL-NW-1 it has a very shallow dovetail. I sometime use a shallow dovetail & then tin the lug & soft solder it to bbl. Measure your bbl. at lug point, minus the bore cal. is your meal thickness-1/2 of that is what you have to work with, go as shallow as you can. Hope this helps...Tom

Tom's got you on the right track. I'm betting that part number he gave you is for the steel lugs. They have nice thin bases.

I have done a very shallow dovetail and then soldered the lug too like Tom suggests. I've also just soldered them onto the surface. Hit both contact patches with a file or sand paper to clean up the surface before soldering.

I would say do just two. One toward the muzzle and the other just ahead of the lock. You will have thicker sections to work with and I find that one does not really need alot of tennons to get the job done. Some of my rifles feature just one lug toward the muzzle end and it works very well though anything other than smallbores I use 2 or 3. I like to use one on smallbores because just of ease of takedown and it is more than strong enough. I would like atleast two on anything 40 and higher though.

I would use three on a 38" (even a 36" for that matter).

The tenons are for keeping the stock fixed to the barrel not the other way around. The stock is pretty "flimsy" on the upper forestock if correctly shaped.

Rule of thumb is if dovetailing is to leave a minimum of .05" of metal between the dovetail and the bore - that makes me a little nervous so I personally shoot for .08" in case I get a little aggressive while cutting the dovetail or have a slight slip.

On a swamped barrel you may not have alot of metal in the first place around the waist, so absolutely solder without a dovetail there (unless you have something like a 40 cal with a C or D weight barrel).

On a swamp I tend to solder all of them (no more work to set-up for 1 as compared with 3 or 4). And have never had a "strength" issue with a soldered lug.

And like suggested, I love the UN-LW-1 lugs - then you can line up your pins horizontally even with a somewhat drastic swamp.

Thanks for all the help guys. galamb, are you suggesting that you do a shallow dovetail and then solder or do you simply solder to the surface of the bottom barrel flat?

For what it's worth, I'm using a .50 B-weight and I'm leaning towards doing normal dovetails to the front and rear and simply soldering to the barrel flat in the waist section.

Thanks again guys, it's appreciated.

I have done both, you can easily just solder the lug to the bottom flat of the barrel. If your solder joint is good the lug will be there forever. Be sure to oil the bore of the barrel after soldering. BJH

I tend to just solder them on with lug that I posted up there.

I have also mixed lugs and staples (I prefer staples if I can use them).

The biggest thing I'm looking for is being able to align the barrel pins on the same horizontal line.

If the lug/staple closest to the breech end is (level) with the location of the lug/staple at the muzzle end then I will use staples there and solder solid lugs at the (thinner sections).

I never dovetail a lug. Anytime I don't have to remove significant metal from the barrel I will always go with that option.

Staples, dovetailed lugs and soldered lugs are all equally "correct".

At either end the pin will be almost snugged up against the bottom of the barrel. Near the waist, the pin will be noticeably below the bottom of the barrel - so particularly at that point a surface soldered lug is helpful in keeping things lined up.

Do Not use 2 underlugs on a 38" barrel. Use 3 underlugs on anything from a 28" barrel up & including a 38" barrel. On a 42" barrel, I have used 3 but prefer 4. Over 42" I Definitely use 4. The more ya use, the better the wood is retained to the barrel. This will keep the wood snug up to the barrel & IF you get any or lose any moisture the wood will not pull away from the barrel.

On a B-50 barrel of 38", I would dovetail all of them, the one close to the waist I would have shallow & the base would be .030 thick & put it in about .020 deep. If you wish to solder it instead, that is OK, what ever hits You the right way. :idunno: I have taken old rifles apart & all of them be soldered.

You do need to lay them all out & also lay out your RR pipes & insure they don't interfere with each other. The Pipes have to be spaced correctly to look correct. The underlugs can be moved some to allow this pipe spacing.

Keith Lisle

Thanks for the tips guys. I've already laid out the pipes and the underlugs and think I'm ready to go now. I'm inclined to dovetail the nearest to the breech and muzzle and solder the one at the waist to keep them mostly inline.

That will work fine. Be SURE to clean the bore well after soldering, as it will burn the oil out of that area & rust there if proper measures are not taken.
Also, don't overheat the barrel. If you get it too hot, when it cools the bore can contract & then you could have a tight spot in the bore.

Keith Lisle