Hammer Striking Force

I have an Old Army that I changed the nipples out on to the ones offered by ToTW that still retain the hex head outer dimensions, but have a TRESSO inside dimension. They are said to be designed with CCI #11 caps in mind.

Rem #11's will fall off of a few of them, and CCI #11 magnums often need a second strike to set them off, but fit nice and tight. I've used a dowel to help push the caps on, but it doesn't seem to help.

I have also chucked them in a drill and used some emory cloth to work them down a little, but it didn't seem to do anything.

Rem #10's work great so far (~50 shots).

#10's just seem impossible to find now, yet there are plenty of CCI #11's magnums. I've yet to see a non magnum CCI #11. Do they exist?

And so I've wondered if I were to upgrade my hammer spring if it would possibly be enough to set off caps that don't quite sit against the nipples correctly? And what would it do to the operation?

I like the idea of being able to fire several types of caps instead of doctoring up the nipples to work with 1...

Ya know,, have you gone through how everything fit's? Making sure nothing is dragging the hammer and/or the other parts.
Here's a great two part tutorial for "tuning" a colt cap-n-ball http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_One.pdf
http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_Two.pdf

I am far from any sort of truly knowledgeable gun mechanics guy, but it seems great, not unlike many other Ruger single actions. The trigger could use a little cleaning up, but it's not terrible.

What would a heavier hammer spring do to the action? I know people tend to exchange them for lighter springs...

I'm also wondering how the nipples would work if I were to lightly sand them near the base to work with CCI #11 mags. Would it likely no longer work well with #10's?

rodwha said:

I am far from any sort of truly knowledgeable gun mechanics guy,

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The instructions and photographs in those tutorials are pretty basic stuff. Like looking for drag marks.

What would a heavier hammer spring do to the action? I know people tend to exchange them for lighter springs...

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I'm not aware of any "heavier" main springs being available on the market.
It could be yours is worn/weak and a replacement might be needed.

I can't address the issue of modifying nipples, I don't have experience with that.

A heavier mainspring will give you a heavier trigger pull. It will also drive the muzzle downward when it strikes the cap more than your present mainspring and may change your point of impact. whether it is a coil or leaf spring you may be able to shim it to increase it's pressure. I would recommend finding a cap that gives you a good group and is easy to obtain and modifying the nipples to suit.

About a year ago I bought a used ROA at an auction. The gun frequently wouldn't fire caps even after buying replacement nipples. I bought a new main spring and had a gunsmith install it. This improved things a bit but not completely. I purchased a set of treso ampco nipples and that was the ticket. Shoots %100 reliably now.

Don

One of my personal gauges of correct hammer spring strength is if the caps are blown off from the nipple which means the hammer is being forced up from the blow back.
My thinking is the main spring should be strong enough to make the hammer stay down and thus the cap( usually split), stay put until the hammer is thumbed back.
When set up in this fashion one knows the nipples are eroded out when the caps start blowing off again. Mike D.

The caps stay put maybe half of the time. I'm usually using stiff loads of 3F Triple 7 though, and so I'm not sure how much that plays into it.

The nipples are ToTW's version of TRESO nipples, but with Ruger's hex head.

This ROA is from '82, and bought by my dad's good friend. I'm not certain how much it was a shot. I suppose I ought to ask. Unfortunately he passed so all I could go on is what my dad recalls. Maybe shimming it would be a good idea.

This is just my personal thinking I have not read it in any service manual or gun article. Seems to me though it is a reasonable gauge of nipple erosion along with possibly helping to prevent a chain fire by keeping the fire corked up at the rear in case a cap comes off from an adjacent cylinder.

The Rugers will take it so if you are using stiff loads I would adjust the spring tension to cork up the load you are using.
As you said you can bush them tighter or have a new one turned of a thicker stock of spring wire. Mike D.

I can't figure out a way to move the spring from the base of the mainspring seat to place a shim there as it appears the best place for it...

I'm considering sanding down my original nipples to see if I can get them to work with the CCI #11 mags as well as others. They just sit there...

SAFETY GLASSES!! A fellow employee got a great deal on a Ruger Single Six that was missing a mainspring. Springs were cheep and easy to get so he went for it. While trying to install it at the kitchen table the spring slipped. Emergency surgery to reattach the retina and the doctor told him he could never shoot a high recoiling gun again (he is about 35) if he wanted to keep the sight in that eye.

Yes, thanks for the reminder, it is always a good idea to have and use them. I usually have my opti-visors on but they are not really safety glasses.
The shim would be tubular around the spring guide at the lower end and would be limited in length to complete coil compression, without bind, at full cock.
I think if it were me I would simply get a heavier spring wire and wind a new one on the lathe. Any good lathe operator ought to be able to wind a coil spring with a few simply made tools. MD

I put on a set of Treso/Ampco Nipples from Jeb Starr. They have the traditional flats & not the Ruger Hex. The originals worked just fine with #10 Rem or CCI caps, but I've got more #11's available, hence the Ampco nipple decision.

Remington & CCI caps all work just fine; no 2nd strikes, falling off or other problems.

As for weak hammer spring - I've owned a multitude of Ruger revolvers over the past several decades & they all use the same spring design. Not sure why you get weak strikes, but doubtful its' the spring.

Compare nipple length vs your originals. Just a little too short & you can get that double strike nonsense plaguing you.

I don't think I'm getting weak strikes, but that the interior design of the caps isn't allowing it to sit flush against the nipple. I figured it may be worthwhile to increase the hammer striking force so that it could push it the rest of the way and still fire so as to work with a greater number of cap designs.

With the way things have become I've looked to online sources for supplies. I have found Grafs, and figure I'll use them for my powder and cap needs. But they only sell CCI caps. Since ToTW claims my nipples were designed for CCI #11's I figure I ought to trust them and buy them, but I'm leery since I got so many misfires using the #11 magnums, and I've never tried their #10's. I'd not like to have a large collection of caps that don't work well.

You need to determine if your hammer is striking the nipple squarely on. To determine this, beg, borrow or steal one of your wife's lipsticks. Use a Q-Tip to apply a small bit on the face of your hammer. Now lower your hammer down on the nipple and give it a tap on the back with a rubber mallet or piece of wood. Then re-cock your hammer and examine the face of the nipple. If you have lipstick all around the face of the nipple, your hammer is striking squarely. If your nipple does have lipstick all around, the hammer is not striking it squarely. If the lipstick is only on the top part of the nipple, your nipple is too short. If it is just on the bottom of the face of the nipple, your nipple is too long. If your nipple is too long or too short, replace them with nipples of the proper length for your gun. To make the best determination of you nipple length, do this to all 6 of your nipples rather than making your judgement call based on only one nipple. Okay, let's assume that all nipples are the proper length. Are they the proper size for the caps that you are using? Remove them and use a micrometer to measure the diameter of each nipple. The reason that I say to measure all of them is that it is possible for someone to accidently drop a nipple of the wrong size into the bin of nipples at the place where you ordered them and then when they picked out 6 nipples for you, one could be just that wrong nipple and then you would be the lucky sole who had 5 correct nipples and one incorrect nipple. It happened to me and in my case it was almost tragic. My incorrectly sized nipple had the wrong threads. It was very close to being right. Enough so that it easily screwed into the nipple hole on my rifle. Having the wrong threads, it blew out. No injury but my wife almost had to do my laundry that evening. Anyway, enough about my problem. Once you make sure that all of your nipples are correct, or have replaced any incorrect ones, determine the diameter of your nipples to determine which caps they are made for and buy those caps. I used a micrometer to measure the nippples on my revolver that I know uses #10 caps and on my rifles that I know use #11 caps and found that the #10 nipples measured an average of 0.154 inches and the nipples on my rifles measured an average of 0.160 inches. Really close in size but there is a difference and that difference makes a difference in which caps will work on them.

Check the price on main springs for a ROA and if they are reasonable, go ahead and replace it. It can't hurt and may resolve your problem. If not, you at least will know that your revolver has a new spring.

BTW if you didn't know, never dry fire a C&B revolver without something on the nipple. You can damage your nipples by dry firing it. FYI

You can get Wolff springs directly from the manufacturer: http://www.gunsprings.com/Revolvers/RUGER/SINGLE ACTION SERIES/cID3/mID52/dID228

They've got everything from Reduced Power to Extra Power springs to choose from.

Where on the tapered cone do you take the measurement, the base or are you measuring length of the cone? Mike D.

I measured the tip of the nipple, its narrowest point. If you are suggesting that a more meaningful set of measurements would have included not only the tip but the base and the length of the nipple, I would fully agree with you. I was just doing a quick set of measurements and, lacking the other measurements, might not be as meaningful as I had intended. :thumbsup:

No suggestion, just need a reference point to get your meaning for a comparison. Mike D.