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Diamond Shelter in the Cold

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What is the coldest or worst kind of weather anyone has stayed in a Diamond? How did you stay warm? Dry? What is the best thing to use for the floor? Bed roll or cot?
I am using a 12x12 and 5' tall at the front, with a ridge pole on the outside.
Aim small, miss small?
 
Well we set one up and the temp went a bit below what the weatherman said it would be. It was 20 degrees when I got up in the morning. At least the tiny thermometer my buddy had said it was that temp.

My opinions are:

5' tall is too high in cold weather if you use a regular fire. The heat you will need to capture will roll right out the front. We found that 31/2 feet with the back end over a log that was like 18" high, worked "ok".

Forget a cot in cold weather unless yours is very close to the ground and you can stuff something like straw under it. Like every bridge you see in colder parts of the United States, and the sign that says "bridge freezes before roadway", that's because the cold air circulates beneath it. The same is true for a cot; circulating air = cold.

If you're on the ground that's where the cold will come from. I take a straw "tick" with me to events. Which is a long, cloth bag, made of ticking material, that I stuff with straw when I arrive where I am camping. Mine is 6' 06" long, and I use a half bale of straw..., which when I tie a cord around the open end of the tick, this compresses down, to an insulated area about 2" thick. Keeps the heat in and the damp away, and pads rocks a bit. When I am done I dump out the straw and roll up the tick. It's an authentic idea, and would work with corn husks, or dry leaves.

To heat the shelter you need a fire with a reflector on the opposite side of the fire from the shelter opening. This reflects heat into the opening and ads warmth. We made ours by pounding some wooden stakes vertical, then then placed some horizontal branches to form a sort of wall, not too close to the fire. This can be tricky if you use the classic diamond shape instead of the lean-to configuration, as the classic diamond uses one of the corners, and a single line to stay "up" at the opening. We used two lines of leather thongs inverted ... / \ .... and the fire needs to be kept low.

It still got cold as the fire burned down, so lots of wool clothing, put on fresh when you bed down is also important.

I hope this helps. I have seen two diamonds face to face with a brazer and hardwood charcoal used..., that is much better, and has enough air flow to not worry about CO poisoning. The folks I saw with this configuration said that you can use a brazer under the canvas if all you have is a single diamond, and in that case you can run the internal pole higher.

LD
 
Not a diamond shelter, but an open-faced lean-to, which is mostly similar. -30F or so, which wasn't a pleasant night, I'd get an hour or so of sleep, wake up and punch up the fire, warm up so I could sleep some more, did that throughout the night. Not particularly comfortable, but I wasn't going to freeze to death, either. As mentioned, build the opening low to capture a little heat, have plenty of padding (grass, straw, evergreen boughs, etc.) under you--put down more than you think you'll need. Good wool blankets, and a buffalo robe or two really helps. Some old hides (I use hair-on deer hides, untanned, yep they shed, so what, they insulate well) underneath your bedding is also a big help.

Dress for it, too.

The best thing you can do is have a good attitude. Go into it knowing that your sleep will be interrupted, and plan accordingly. Lay in plenty of extra wood within easy reach. You'll survive.

Rod
 
Like Rod I've used open-faced lean-to's down to about -30F. Use a real thick bed of pine or spruce broughs under you. A modern sleeping pad definately helps but if you are going primitive, at least try to lay down a sheet of canvas on top of the broughs under you.

Build a log fire the length of the lean-to and use a reflector wall behind it to reflect heat back at you. Google the US Army survival manual and you'll find diagrams of the setup. Critter hides (caribou works real well) over and under you as well as wool blankets. Wear your wool clothing in the sack. Canvas over you helps cut down on convective heat loss.

Nearby, keep plenty of wood to re-stoke the fire. Keep some snacks handy when you wake up cold and eat a light snack before bed. WEAR A KNIT HAT. Change your socks and moc liners before going to bed and by all means, take a leak before turning in. Fill your canteen with hot water before going to bed and keep your canteen under the blankets with you between your legs up in your crotch. The hot water will help warm your blood flowing through your arteries close to your crotch.

You'll be surprised how warm you can actually be! If you do get chilly, you'll at least survive OK.
 
Thanks guys. I have camped in very cold weather out in Montana, but not with this Diamond shelter. Maybe it is time to look at something else, but it is so darn easy to pack in and out, instead of dragging poles everywhere.

Aim small, miss small...
 
Use the diamond shelter pitched lean-to style. A square of canvas is a square of canvas. It doesn't much matter where the ties are located. :thumbsup:
 
just like in the movie J J if you can dig a trench n burn your fire in it all day long then bury it well with coals still burning it will help keep ya warm most of the night, I've done it several times n it really will work, but like the old man said, hehe make sure ya got enough dirt over it or you WILL GET A RATHER RUDE AWAKENING. coldest was -7 with about a 25 mile an hour wind, thats as cold as I ever want to be LOL
 
Custom Smokepole said:
What is the coldest or worst kind of weather anyone has stayed in a Diamond? How did you stay warm? Dry? What is the best thing to use for the floor? Bed roll or cot?
I am using a 12x12 and 5' tall at the front, with a ridge pole on the outside.
Aim small, miss small?

I did a short diamond in dec. day probable averaged about 20 deg. the evening around 0 I recon. bad idea as the shap of the diamon prevents any heat from reaching back to the tip of the shelter. I slept on abot 8 iches of pine boughs and was relatively comfortable.
February I did a traditional reflector leanto on about 3 feet of snow and again on pine boughs. much better use of canvas. it rained and snowed and the temp wavered from around 0 to 20 deg if I recall correctly.
I would definately choose another design than the plow point (diamond). I would put something over my head anyway. the rain that hoit us in Feb was such that our guide ropes were coated with almost 1/4 inch of ice. we olayed heck getting the knots undone that next morning!
 
Thanks again for everyones replys. I will take all in consideration when I head out.
Aim small, miss small...
 
If your gonna mess around in deadly temps you really want to be the owner of a high quality down sleeping bag. If you need to be HC then go shoot some geese and make your own with period correct fabric. There is simply no alternative unless you can deliver 75 pounds of fur and wool to your camp.

Beyond the down bag you want to look at what you are wearing. Silk under coarse wool is HC and like Down is the final word in cold weather survival.

In uber cold and if possible sleep in the warmer afternoon and leave the coldest part of the clock for tea drinking and star gazing.
 
Amen.

Townsend Whelen of lean-to tent fame acknowledged that it wasn't good for very cold conditions. For that you need a closed tent and a down sleeping bag.

------------
Flintlock, black powdera dn round balls - Life is Sweet
 
Tetsa Prowler said:
If your gonna mess around in deadly temps you really want to be the owner of a high quality down sleeping bag. If you need to be HC then go shoot some geese and make your own with period correct fabric. There is simply no alternative unless you can deliver 75 pounds of fur and wool to your camp.
Kinda makes you wonder how people survived all those centuries before the invention of the down sleeping bag?
 
Tetsa Prowler said:
If your gonna mess around in deadly temps you really want to be the owner of a high quality down sleeping bag. If you need to be HC then go shoot some geese and make your own with period correct fabric. There is simply no alternative unless you can deliver 75 pounds of fur and wool to your camp.

Beyond the down bag you want to look at what you are wearing. Silk under coarse wool is HC and like Down is the final word in cold weather survival.

In uber cold and if possible sleep in the warmer afternoon and leave the coldest part of the clock for tea drinking and star gazing.

"Really the following is a quote from another board made by a gent who is a musher in Alaska.
My winter bed roll is an Early's of Witney 4 pt., a hand woven blanket of similar weight and size, inside a canvas wrap (7 X 7 foot square canoe sail) that blocks any stray breezes. Typical bed is six to 8 inches of spruce boughs. Most typical shelter is a lean-to set up to block the prevailing wind, though I sometimes prefer to just crawl into the sled bag on my traineau when that is my means of travel. I also use my capote or greatcoat in lieu of an extra blanket over all and am dressed in a manner similar to what you propose.

That set up has kept me comfortable at -30 F (- 34C) and has been tolerable at -40 (-40 C). The only modern sleeping bag I know of that can perform as well is Wiggy's Antarctic with an overbag and his company's specialized pad, a $550.00 combination at retail."
Here's his mushing website - http://www.tworiversak.com/mushing.htm

I've used the same basic setup with the addition of a buffalo robe and was comfortable to -35°.
My "tent" was a simple wedge style as per Miller's prints made of heavy linen canvas. Clothes were a lot of BT leather with two shirts(linen & Cotton per the RMFT period trade lists, a medium weight wool flannel coat per AJ Miller, wool socks and under leggings (with BT over leggings), wool clout, no long johns - cold you bet at times, but not so uncomfortable that I couldn't have survuved

As Blackhand said based on your post I reckon nobody must have survived in the early days since they did not have down sleeping bags (if they are PC for the 1750-1850 era they sure don't show up in the historical record - so if you have something that states elswise then please supply links or a footnoted quote).
Silk undies - yep I love mine and my Merino wool ones too, but they aren't PC as far as the 1750-1850 historical records go - Yes some folks did wear undies in both the 18th and early 19th Centuries but they were not common wear for most of the lower middle and poor classes and most were made of linen or later cotton, with some wool flannel documented. Again if as you noted they are HC/PC - 1) for who, when, and where and 2) again lets see some period citations........
 
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I have slept in much warmer temps than that (canvas lodges) and did not stay warm. Toughed through it because it was....PC/HC...whatever. No more, age did bring some smartness. Either stay in tin teepee with heat on or don't go these days.

EDIT: BTW there is cold and there is cold. Dry temps tend to not feel as cold. One ronny I was on was in a valley next to a small river. It was a bowl. In summer the humidity made it the most uncomfortable place anywhere, regardless of temps. In winter, the humidity, again, made it impossibly cold and near impossible to wear enuf clothes to stay warm.
 
one thing I've found over the years is although wool is probably the best material to have in cold weather it also works better in windy conditions if you have something over it to break the wind.I try n explain it to guys by saying, think of your house, the wool is the insulation that keeps the warmth in n the leather or a tightly woven cloth outer garment is like tyvex house wrap, it breaks the wind so the warmth doesn't get sucked away by the wind. This example seems to get the idea across to many that are haveing a hard time in colder weather. Wrap a stout piece of canvas/leather around you or yer bed roll n you will stay degrees warmer IMHO YMHS Birdman
 
Thanks guys for everyones input. Great ideas, and food for thought.
Aim small, miss small...
 

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