Schooling on set triggers please?

I've never used set triggers. I'm starting to upgrade my Lyman Deerstalker. It will be more of a wood's loafing rifle and tin can slayer. However, I'm going to use Dutch's system and all the shooting, tuning and upgrade help here to build a tack driver. Hunting isn't a big consideration and it will be whitetail max if I reconsider (health issue, I have no doubt a 54 PRB will do the job).

Many folks like the Davis Deerslayer trigger around this patch of bush.

Could folks please discuss using set triggers and such. I'm not fond of hair triggers, about a couple of pounds would be my low limit, and wonder about using the unset trigger? Does it harm the trigger to use it unset, say in a hunting situation?

Anyone ever tuned a stock Lyman trigger to good target satisfaction?

Using a 2 lb minimum, you might be better off with the single trigger. I see little need for a set trigger if one is not comfortable with light pulls. That is the main purpose of the set triggers. A lighter pull, and no perceptable travel. Everyone has their own standards for this.

Thanks Wick, it seems I'm dragging old ideas into a learning discussion. I'll scrap the whole two pound thing and just take advice, as I should.

How light is the Davis trigger when set?

The Davis Deerslayer is a Double Set, Double Lever (or blade) trigger that can be shot either "set" or "unset". It doesn't care.

To fire a gun with this trigger left "unset" you will just ignore the rear "trigger" and use the front trigger.

The trigger pull force needed to fire the gun with the set trigger left unset will depend on your lock and the location of the trigger, relative to the locks sear arm. The sear arm is the part that sticks out on the inside of the lock. The "lever' or blade(s) as I prefer to call them pushes up on it to cause the lock to release.
This force may be only a couple of pounds or considerably more.

If the rear "trigger" is pulled to "set" the trigger assembly it compresses a stout spring.
As the rear trigger is pulled, a catch on the front trigger will latch onto the rear triggers blade and hold it in the compressed position.

A very light pressure on the front trigger will cause the front triggers catch to release the rear triggers blade.
When this happens, the spring forces the rear triggers blade up rapidly where it hits the sear arm and releases the lock.

Setting the rear trigger and releasing it by pulling the front trigger will not damage the trigger assembly.
If the cock or hammer is in the fired position (down) it won't damage the lock either.

This allows one to practice using the set trigger on the uncocked gun as much as they like.

If the lock is at the half cock position when doing this setting and releasing the impact of the rear triggers blade on the sear arm may break the sear or the half cock notch in the tumbler.
Needless to say this is not good so, do not set and release the set trigger when the guns lock is in the half cock position.

There is a screw hanging down between the triggers and many people think it adjusts the pressure needed to fire the set lock.
This is totally untrue. It does not adjust the pressure on the front trigger.

What the screw does adjust is the engagement between the front triggers catch and the rear trigger latch.
If the front triggers catch deeply engages the rear triggers latch, the shooter will have to pull the front trigger more to fire the gun. Notice, I did NOT say he will have to pull it harder, just further.

If the screw is adjusted too far in, the front triggers catch will not engage the rear triggers latch at all so the rear trigger cannot be set.

A worse condition is where someone has adjusted the screw so that only a tiny amount of the front triggers catch will be engaged with the rear trigger.
In this condition, the slightest bump or jar can cause the triggers to release and fire the gun.

Hope this helps some of you folks who have never used a double set trigger before.

Bob, read Zonies explanation a couple times,
esp the 9th and 10 paragraphs,, that's the key,, it's not about trigger pull weight, it's about the "break" of that "engagement" notch on the front trigger

Anyone ever tuned a stock Lyman trigger to good target satisfaction?

Click to expand...

Yes, the Lyman/Investarms and the T/C, they both can be impoved with a full disassembly and polishing smooth the sides and bearing surfaces free of any burrs or rough areas of the trigger arms/cams themselves and the engagement notch can be improved if your carefull. The notch and engagement cam should be left square and not sloped or tipped at all.
Folks spend alot of time with the screw that adjusts the engagement and forget about the leaf spring that drives the rear cam, That spring has some adjustment room too and a nice trigger has that spring adjusted proper. Too tight and it looses something, or maybe it's just too much action,,

The Davis trigger is still an improvment over the reworked factory triggers, small,, but it's there.
The geometry is just a little different, enough for the Davis to have a better balanced feel and crisp break right out of the package.

Good description from Zonie.

Not mentioned was the fact that alot of hunters choose to use only the front trigger, unset, when hunting. Like Zonie mentioned, they just ignore the rear trigger. This is preferred by some because of cold fingers, gloved hands, or buck fever, any of which can make a hair trigger undesireable in the field. Some hunters use the set trigger, but set the rear trigger after they cock the hammer, and just before they shoot at an animal. And others use the set trigger for all purpose (like myself), target and hunting, and keep the triggers set all the time. It's just a matter of habit, and preference, to set the triggers as part of a loading routine.

If you do get to go hunting with your new triggers, you have three options to choose from. Bill

Before attempting to upgrade your trigger be certain your Deer Stalker lock is fited with a fly. This is a small cam that is on the tumbler that prevents the sear from engaging the half-cock notch after it is released. Without a fly in place your set trigger will result in the hammer only dropping to half cock, possibly damaging sear or tumbler.

curator's advice is good- you really should check this out before you drop some serious coin on a Davis trigger. having said that, I've used Davis triggers in all but one of my builds and i really like their feel. they're well worth the money.

what Zonie said is true; if you use set triggers 'in the field' you have a bunch of different options, and you'll have more control over whatever situation in which you find yourself.

I always use the set trigger on soda cans- and always aim for center of mass: the soda can might be hopped up on drugs and have strength of three or four soda cans, and they often charge when they're wounded.
:rotf:

The Davis Deerslayer is a Double Set, Double Lever (or blade) trigger that can be shot either "set" or "unset". It doesn't care.

To fire a gun with this trigger left "unset" you will just ignore the rear "trigger" and use the front trigger.

Click to expand...

That is all you need to know for this trigger.
There are so many sett trigger configurations (single-set single lever, double set double, double this, single that) learning them all will have you dizzy before you are done.
If the Davis meets your needs, go for it. If you don't need it, don't bother. I shot primarily a single rifle for almost 30 years that did not have a sett trigger and did very will with it both on the range and in the woods.

Thanks Zonie, an outstanding post, and also everyone else. Specially the advice on how to avoid breakage from a greenhorn stunt and most importantly the safety stuff.

Many threads state the Davis works with a Lyman lock. I'll check the fly issue though.

If anyone has a Davis on a Lyman could you estimate the set and unset trigger weights please?

Unset; 8-10#
Set; Again it's NOT a weight of pull it's a travel of the break, preceived weight of pull is adjusted to your desire
by a screw, from 1/4# all the way to the same as unset.

About the "fly":

Without going too much into what it looks like and where it is, it's tiny and goes into the locks tumbler at the half cock notch.

The easiest way to check if your lock has a "fly" in it is to raise the hammer or cock to the Full Cocked position.

Place your thumb on the hammer or cock to keep it from falling and pull the trigger.
When you do this, allow the hammer/cock to move slightly forward.
While the hammer/cock is in this released state, remove all tension on the trigger.

Now, lower the hammer/cock at a moderate speed. Notice I said "lower" the hammer. Do not allow it to fall freely.

If the lock has a fly in it the hammer/cock will hesitate slightly when it gets to the half cock position and then continue on down to the fired condition.
If this happens, you can use the Deerslayer trigger in your gun.

If the lock does NOT have a fly in it, the hammer/cock will stop at the half cock notch and move no further, even with a little force. (Don't force it too hard or you will break the half cock notch in the tumbler or the sear).

IF the lock DOES NOT HAVE a fly in it, you CANNOT use a Double Set Double Lever trigger assembly.

As the Deerslayer is that kind of trigger your stuck with the simple single trigger you have.

Canuck Bob said:

I've never used set triggers. I'm starting to upgrade my Lyman Deerstalker. It will be more of a wood's loafing rifle and tin can slayer. However, I'm going to use Dutch's system and all the shooting, tuning and upgrade help here to build a tack driver. Hunting isn't a big consideration and it will be whitetail max if I reconsider (health issue, I have no doubt a 54 PRB will do the job).

Many folks like the Davis Deerslayer trigger around this patch of bush.

Could folks please discuss using set triggers and such. I'm not fond of hair triggers, about a couple of pounds would be my low limit, and wonder about using the unset trigger? Does it harm the trigger to use it unset, say in a hunting situation?

Anyone ever tuned a stock Lyman trigger to good target satisfaction?

Click to expand...

Also of note with double set-triggers, you don't have to have it set to a "hair" trigger, you can adjust it so it's lighter than the un-set condition, but not at "hair levels". I've found the GPR trigger to be relatively easy to adjust.

I have a Deerstalker in the mail, and neglected to take into account that it is a single trigger, unlike my other Investarms/Cabelas rifles.

All discussion here was about double set triggers, however, the Deerstalker doesn't appear to have a long enough triggerguard to fit a double trigger.

Does anyone know of a single set trigger available for the Deerstalker that requires minimal fitting?

Nope.
The trigger and trigger guard is a single piece on the Deerstalker.
It's just as easy to fit a Lyman Double trigger in the single trigger inlet and the proper larger TG

Using a set trigger, is just like anything else. Practice, until it becomes comfortable. I set the trigger, and don't even think about it. I've never spooked a deer, buy setting the trigger, nor have a ever missed the opportunity to shoot a deer because of the set trigger. If I had a 2-3 pound singer trigger, I would be happy with that too.

There is no "drop in" single set trigger currently available the way the Deerslayer DST was specifically designed to be a drop in for T/C and Lyman.

Additionally, as noted here, unless you want it for target use, the "lack" of set triggers is not a detriment in hunting.

MBS sells an outstanding single set trigger, but at 75 bucks (plus alot of fitting), unless you "need" one it's probably not worth it if you have a functional single trigger..

Zonie, has described it pretty well. Talking about the location of the trigger arm, in relation to the sear arm. In a modern firearm the action and trigger are mechanically built together, so the geometry of the trigger and sear are tied together. In a traditional rifle the location of the lock and the inletted location of the trigger, can vary enough, that the trigger arm may be closer to the pivot of the trigger, or out at the end of the trigger arm. The set trigger makes up for difference, by springing up and slapping the sear, rather than having to push the sear. Reducing spring weight, on main spring, or reducing sear engagement, can lower trigger pull, but either one, if not done properly can make ignition unreliable or ruin the tumbler, due to improper angle, or removing to much metal. A gun smith, might be a better choice, if either of these are chosen.