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Suicide with flintlock?

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ebiggs1

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Did anybody see the Meriwether Lewis (Lewis & Clark) thing on History Decoded? (don't know when it was ,DVR) Well the jest of the story is Lewis shot himself, suicide, with a 69 cal flintlock pistol. Twice! Once in the back of the head and the other in the front of his chest. You guys that are familiar with these big flintlocks have an opinion on that?
 
Yes, murdered. You can't calmly reload after putting one in your torso and managing another in the (back?) of the head. Yippee for these TV historians :shake:
 
Swampy said:
After seeing all that they uncovered, Lewis was most definately murdered.

Interesting about the murder part. His last words were, "I am no coward, but I am so strong; it is so hard to die." As if he was embarassed to still be alive after trying to take his own life. President Jefferson said he wasn't surprised by the news of his suicide.
I never saw this documentary and I'd be interested to hear the details on the murder side of it.

Read more: http://www.answers.com/topic/meriwether-lewis#ixzz1AOt7PDXC
 
Last edited by a moderator:
ebiggs said:
Did anybody see the Meriwether Lewis (Lewis & Clark) thing on History Decoded? (don't know when it was ,DVR) Well the jest of the story is Lewis shot himself, suicide, with a 69 cal flintlock pistol. Twice! Once in the back of the head and the other in the front of his chest. You guys that are familiar with these big flintlocks have an opinion on that?

There was a Capt. Van Renssealer at the battle of Fallen Timbers during the Northwest Indian wars that was hit in the chest with a ball from a .69 rifle or musket. It passed through one of his lungs. He insisted on getting back on his horse.

After the battle, Van Renssealer was being transported back to Fort Recovery, I believe, with the rest of the wounded. He again, insisted he ride his horse back while other men with similar wounds went back on stretchers.

Van Renssealer lived while all the other men with chest wounds passed away during the trip. The physicians believed Capt. Van Renssealer lived because he kept himself upright and was able to cough out the blood from his lung. The others effectively drowned in their own blood as it pooled in their lungs.

It's hard to believe somone in 1794 could live through a chest shot with a .69, but he did and went on to serve in the Federal Government.
 
And what the decoded folks probably didn't even reveal, whas that Lewis' father was subject to bouts of severe depression, called "melancholy" in those days. So was Lewis. He was hooked on heroin and other drugs and had been severely rebuked in writing by Jefferson for not editing his journals for publication and getting them out for the public to read. Land rich and money poor, depressed and being called on the carpet by Jefferson. Did the decoder show also mention that Lewis had partially flayed his own leg?? What sane person starts to skin himself?

Who was the Rev war hero that suffered over a dozen wounds and kept fighting tied to a wagon wheel so he could stay upright ??
 
Watch the show and decide for yourself. Yes they mentioned the Melancoly he suffered, thats why when told he commited suicide Jefferson believed it and investgated no further. Fact is Lewis was surounded by bad men and the investigators proved that fact.
 
Not sure why you would say that. Did you watch the program? I thought it was an eye opener and the stuff they uncovered, made sense. More so than a suicide.
 
It would be possible to shoot yourself in the back of the head. The spot at the base of the skull would turn out the lights quick. My question would be why he would not have shot himself there in the first place?
 
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Ozark

As one who has "worked" a significant number of suicides, I can tell you they shoot themselves in strange places.

Dan
 
Swampy said:
Not sure why you would say that. Did you watch the program? I thought it was an eye opener and the stuff they uncovered, made sense. More so than a suicide.

Hey Swampy.
The reason is I asked that is that I don't understand why anybody would believe what they were told by a TV.
 
I am aware of a case in which a person decided to commit suicide with a handgun.

The pistol was a Loricin or some damned thing in .25acp. Forensics showed that the person put the pistol to his temple and fired. He was rendered unconscious.

A short while later he woke up and repeated the process. It was successful the second time.

After a while dealing with this stuff, you find that anything that can happen with a bullet will happen at one time or another. Also, things which shouldn't happen with a bullet somehow happen at one time or another, as well.

Josh
 
Ain't that the truth! At one time I worked in Denver driving a wheel chair van and one of the severely handicapped people I sometimes hauled had tried to blow his head off with a 12 gauge shotgun. He only succeeded in blowing his face off. He was severely brain damaged but still alive, whether or not he knew it.
 
I had long ago heard of the controversy surrounding Lewis' suicide/murder. I lean toward the murder theory though I did not see the history channel program. There was always the feeling that "something" didn't add up.

I've investigated suicides and have seen what people can do and how they sometimes survive. I've also been acquainted with "suicides" that smelled highly of murder and were covered up. One such case was an off duty cop who was found in a river five(+ or -) miles from his car - which was nowhere near a river - with a bullet in the back of his head. The departments head man called it suicide and would allow no further investigation and made sure the original case file went missing.

Some people say "follow your gut"; I say "follow your nose".
 
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