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HERB..JUST FOR YOU

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Good to hear it's not just me with this gun. Thanks.

This was an experiment that I suspected what the outcome would be.

Sorry Herb. I tried. :idunno:
 
I told you all I know and you still don't know nuttin'. Doesn't sound like your nipple is a HotShot nipple?
 
I just cleaned the gun. While cleaning the nipple I took a better look at it. It's not a Treso. The hole is too big. It's stainless. I'm not sure exactly what it is.

I'll give a hot shot a try. Who handles them?
 
capper,
i have a .54 renegade also. and another with a gm .58 1-70" twist. i have experienced the same thing-delayed ignition on some shots. i hate to say this but i narrowed it down to the cci caps. they are the mag type. with win bp caps i NEVER HAVE A PROBLEM AT ALL. bought 300 at walmart today and they were on sale. i use grafs powder as well as goex in my rifles. :idunno:
 
Capper said:
I was going to do that. It looks like a Treso on it now. Maybe the hole is too small.

I like the Treso nipples on my C&B's, because it keeps the caps from blowing off. It doesn't seem to be the hot tip for sidelocks though.

Take the nipple out and clean the flash channel real well. Then check to see if the hole in the nipple is just large enough to push the end of a paper clip through. Some nipples have such a small hole they foul easily. I open the hole to .035 with a dremel tool. Any larger hole may cause blowback on some rifles. I've never had that problem with any of the TC or Invest Arms rifles. I can shoot 50 rounds of T7, Pyrodex, or Goex with no misfires. Murphys oil soap and Ballistol, dried, for patch lube. All my caplocks are more reliable set up that way. Use the paper clip wire to clear the nipple if needed. I put my powder in a horn or flask so only you know what you are shooting. I shoot all 3 powders mentioned and have had good success from all. One of the best shooters at my local club shoots T7 and never runs a patch down the barrel untill the shoot is over. They all require a good cleaning and lube at the end of the day. More people shoot BP subs than may say.
Have Fun! :)
 
I think I swab every shot more to put out any burning embers than to clean it. Although a clean barrel seems like a good idea too.

I'm going to have to tear the house apart to find a paper clip.
 
I have been shooting TCs since the early 80s mostly with pyrodex. With good nipples and no excess oil in the barrel or flash channel it goes boom every time with no delays. I do shoot black now that I have discovered you can mail order it but if pyrodex was all I could easily obtain I will shoot it with no worries. Chris
 
Capper,

That delay is put there on purpose . . . kinda like the old "ball & dummy drill" where a friend loads your gun for you, then hands it to you . . . you don't know if it is loaded live, or a dummy in the gun! Helps in learning "un-flinching"! :rotf:

I'm glad to see you learning things for yourself, and that you have an open mind to try the subs . . . :wink:

BTW my Ampco nipple I can't get a paper clip through . . . but it still works every-time (as long as I remember to put the main charge down the barrel first!) :surrender:
 
Capper said:
I just cleaned the gun. While cleaning the nipple I took a better look at it. It's not a Treso. The hole is too big. It's stainless. I'm not sure exactly what it is.

I'll give a hot shot a try. Who handles them?

Hey Cap', HotShot is mainly handled by T/C now.

I have one on my New Englander, and honestly I can't tell the difference. It has a slightly larger hole, maybe .040", but hell, I was drilling them out to that size anyway to handle Pyrodex.

You will still get a "snap boom" effect as opposed to the BOOM you get with the straight Pyrodex.

The reason I mixed the two, besides pure experimentation, is just to have something that will readily ignite without a delay in firing should I ever run out of my Goex source.

I use Goex to shoot, and will until it's banned.

I will admit that the Pyrodex with the Goex booster does burn cleaner and does not seem to cause rust any more than straight black.

Josh
 
Well, you're an experimenting, mad scientist Josh.

I like to keep my life simple. I find something that works, and stay with it.

It would have been cheaper and easier to use Pyro, but i'm not going to jump through hoops to do it.

Since my gun is new to me. I haven't given up. The gun sat in the shop for year. I did get some rust and gunk when I first cleaned it. I got the barrel squeaky clean, but wasn't sure about the breech. When I ran a pipe cleaner through it, it seemed clogged, but being a new gun I wasn't sure what it should feel like clean. That's how I shot it and was getting delays. Last night I cleaned it and really pumped for 15 minutes. I used warm/hot water, soap, and Ballistol. It seemed the stream I pumped out was getting stronger and stronger.
Then after it was all done and dried off I ran another pipe cleaner through the channel. It went through further and easier. I think it was a bit clogged. I also did a better job of cleaning the nipple, and the hole seems bigger now.

When I was shooting and getting the delays. I never got one after clearing out the nipple and shooting a cap off to make sure it was clear. It always took a couple of shots after that to get a delay.

I might have made it worse by swabbing every shot. I could have been shoving more crud down there.

This is what bothers me about Pyro. It works if everything is perfect. I feel that even though I had crud packed in there. BP would have fired.

You could look at my targets, and see easily every shot that was a delay. I'm not a good enough target shooter to hold steady with a delay. I jerk it off every time. I can't afford that during a competition, or a hunt. I need one bang. Not a little bang and a big bang.

So there.
 
My problem I had with pyrodex was it would not go in to the drum on my cap gun reliably with the slap on the lock so firing was delayed or sometimes not at all. With black it fires first cap every time. Pyrodex need direct flame of 700 to 800 deg to burn Where black will Explode with radiant heat of 400 to 500 deg So that equals more reliable firing.Just the facts no opinion :hatsoff:
 
I bought a can of Pyrodex R/S just to find out how it would shoot in my T/C Hawken.
It works, sorta kinda :haha:
I found out to get reliable ignition I really had to make sure there was no carbon and other crud left down in the bottom of the barrel or in the channel to the nipple.
Thing had to be clean clean clean!
 
Hot Shot nipple is Thompson Center's item No. 7075, sold here by Wal Mart and a sporting good store. Wal Mart also sold a "Flint River 7271 #11 Hot Shot Nipple, for T/C, Remington and Knight Muzzleloaders, 1/4-28 Thread". Does not say who made that one. The paper clip test is the size of the hole (good idea, 1sgt!). The T/C takes an .034 clip easily but not an .038 clip. The Flint River takes that .034 clip exactly. Track sells the T/C, Muzzleloader Builder Supply sells a "Spitfire Nipple", same thing, your gun shop should have hot shot nipples. They make all the difference. I have shot CCI magnums against CCI 11s and Remington (supposedly "hotter") through my chronograph. The 11's and Rems are the same velocity and accuracy. The CCI Magnums gave maybe 20 fps more velocity and poorer accuracy in that one test. Lyman used the CCI 11s for their black powder and Pyrodex testing for their book, over 4,000 shots, not one magnum there. They work flawlessly.
 
I just went to a neighbor and got a paper clip. If we're talking about the small paper clip. It goes in easily.
 
Herb,
I can honestly say I have used Pyrodex RS in my TC Hawken for 35+ years and not had any of the problems mentioned here. But recently I bought a Perdersoli 12 ga. SxS and it wouldn't fire two shots in a row (unless it was the other barrel). It was just horrible. I threw the Pedersoli nipples in the trash and replaced them with TC's and it has shot well ever since. Even got a pheasant with it this year.

Everybody knows, however, real guns have a flint and BP down the tube!
 
It's really windy today, and I wasn't going to shoot. I can't just sit here.

I want to try my clean channel and nipple. I'll stop at the gun shop and try some other caps. He might have a nipple too, but I doubt it.

I'll try shooting with out swabbing, but it goes against my grain.

Some lunch, and i'm off to burn some powder.

Should I shoot the Funnydex or the Fruity T7?
 
I didn't see where you flushed the bore, and flash channel with alcohol, before taking the gun to your range. If you left oil in the channel, or powder chamber( if it has one), that would explain why you could not get more than a couple of shots off before you had a hang-fire.

I suggest:

1. Remove the nipple and clean out screw and examine that flash channel closely for any obstructions. If you see some, you have two choices: A. you can use a drill, the same size as the existing diameter of the flash channel, to clean out the obstructions; or B. You can use the next size larger drill bit( Use # drill sizes) to slightly enlarge that flash channel, to make it a bit easier for powder to flow down into it, and over to your nipple.

2. Replace the nipple with something more reliable. I don't know what kind of nipple is in the gun, and I suspect you can't tell, either. I have never had a percussion gun shoot WORSE by changing the nipple.


:hmm: :thumbsup:
 
No clean out screw Paul, but I don't get oil in the channel.


Ok, I had a good session at the range today, and everything I suspected was true.

On the advice of Zonie. I didn't swab all day. I shot 15 loads each of T7 and Pyro.

I started with Pyro 60gr. Very accurate at 25 and 50 yds. 6" low at 100 yds. Increased to 70 gr and right on at 100 yds and a bit high at shorter distances. easy to hold 6 o clock at short distances.
15 shots with no hangfires. I did run the paper clip in the nipple every 5 shots. It never felt clogged.
Loading didn't feel much different than when I swabbed to bore every shot. Maybe just a hair harder, but not much.

Before switching the the T7 I thought it only fair to start with what the Pyro had. So. I cleaned the bore, channel and nipple. What surprised me was how clean the bore was. It was no different than when I cleaned after every shot.

I started with 60gr of T7. I figured that would be close to 70 gr of Pyro. It didn't shoot any more accurate. No misfires on the first 5 shots. I picked the nipple after the 5th shot and it was much more clogged than the Pyro. Kind of hard and crunchy. After 10 shots I took out the nipple to look at it. I had started to get very small hangfires. The nipple had a hard crust on it. Must be the fruit in it. :idunno: I shot 5 more shots to end the day. Nipple crusted up again. I got rid of the T7, because I knew I wouldn't use it anymore.

I would use the Pyro if I couldn't get BP, but I can get BP. So, that's what i'll be using.

I can only think that today was better than yesterday, because I got the channel cleaned out last night.

One thing shined today. The gun. The more I shoot it. The more I like it.
 
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