OK, I've been looking on ebay and have found a few TC Hawkins stocks with sidelock and all parts without the barrel. They say the barrel inlet is 15\16 inch. Now as I understand it, the Seneca was 15\16 and the standard Hawkins was 1" barrel. Am I wrong? The Seneca 45 cal is what I want to get . What is the difference. I want the lighter gun. I want the .45 Cal. Did they make a regular Hawkin in .45 Cal. Do they know what they have on ebay? Please give me some help, and if anyone out there knows of a website that can help me please include it here.
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Difference in Hawken and Seneca?
- Thread starter kbbgood
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50cal.cliff
58 Cal.
I am not a TC man so can't really address the what barrel goes with what.
However from my experience with fleabay I will say this. Do your research and know what you are talking about and looking at.
I have bought stuff that the seller didn't really know what they had. I looked at the pictures and was informed enough to realize the item they were selling was not what they represented it too be.
I contacted them and I explained why what they had was not what they were saying it was. I also knew the going price for what they really did have and based on that I made a fair offer, take it or leave it, and they took it!
Basically what it boiled down to was they thought they had one model of this item when they really had a different model and the model they had was not nearly as valuable!
You have to be as informed about what you are buying as you can possibly be. It also don't hurt to look at their approval rating and why the different people made that approval rating!
However from my experience with fleabay I will say this. Do your research and know what you are talking about and looking at.
I have bought stuff that the seller didn't really know what they had. I looked at the pictures and was informed enough to realize the item they were selling was not what they represented it too be.
I contacted them and I explained why what they had was not what they were saying it was. I also knew the going price for what they really did have and based on that I made a fair offer, take it or leave it, and they took it!
Basically what it boiled down to was they thought they had one model of this item when they really had a different model and the model they had was not nearly as valuable!
You have to be as informed about what you are buying as you can possibly be. It also don't hurt to look at their approval rating and why the different people made that approval rating!
Yes, the TC made the 'not really a hawken' and a Seneca, both were made in .45 cal.
I happen to have one of each in my safe and measured just for you.
The 'hawken' original barrel is 15/16" across the flats as it's later installed Douglas does.
The Seneca was purchased without a barrel and we installed a Douglas barrel later. It measures 3/4" across the flats.
Both are early versions, ca. 1970.
I happen to have one of each in my safe and measured just for you.
The 'hawken' original barrel is 15/16" across the flats as it's later installed Douglas does.
The Seneca was purchased without a barrel and we installed a Douglas barrel later. It measures 3/4" across the flats.
Both are early versions, ca. 1970.
think it depends on the caliber
my .50 hawken is 15/16
my .54 renegade is a full inch
my .50 hawken is 15/16
my .54 renegade is a full inch
Pacobillie
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flintlock62 said:
.45 and .50 TC Hawkens measure 15/16" across the flats.
don hepler
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I have 8 TC's
So here goes---Hawkens 45 and 50 are 15/16
Hawkens 54 and larger 1 inch
Seneca 36 and 45 are 13/16
Renegades are 1 inch
But here is the real difference between the Hawken and the Seneca, the Seneca is a completely scaled down version of the Hawken. It looks tiny compared to a Hawken. The Seneca lock and trigger look like the same ones on the Patriot pistol, except the set trigger is reversed on the Patriot. The set trigger on the Patriot is in front.
I weighed the Seneca on my fish scales at 6lb.1oz
I don't know what the twist rate differences, between the Hawken and Seneca. But the 36 cal. Seneca is supper accurate.
So here goes---Hawkens 45 and 50 are 15/16
Hawkens 54 and larger 1 inch
Seneca 36 and 45 are 13/16
Renegades are 1 inch
But here is the real difference between the Hawken and the Seneca, the Seneca is a completely scaled down version of the Hawken. It looks tiny compared to a Hawken. The Seneca lock and trigger look like the same ones on the Patriot pistol, except the set trigger is reversed on the Patriot. The set trigger on the Patriot is in front.
I weighed the Seneca on my fish scales at 6lb.1oz
I don't know what the twist rate differences, between the Hawken and Seneca. But the 36 cal. Seneca is supper accurate.
Well done hadden, thanks for straightening out the mess, :thumbsup:
Rat Trapper
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The TC Seneca is a much smaller rifle that looks like a little TC Hawken. The barrels on the Seneca are 13/16th.
Rat Trapper said:
Does that mean my tape measure and calipers are broken?
My Seneca is 12/16" really 3/4".
You have gotten some good advice on the T/C Hawken and Seneca so far.
Regarding ebay, quite a few sellers do not know much about what they have. They often don't know the condition... is the bore rusted, pitted or does it have other issues like a bulge or ring, do the lock and triggers work correctly, was the gun built from a kit, etc.
Also, are you o.k. with a mismatched numbered barrel and stock? Seneca's are becoming collectible. If you eventually move on and sell or trade; a mismatched rifle is worth less than a correct one. On ebay someone else may outbid you for the other half of the Seneca.
Senecas do come up for sale here on MLF free classified ads. You could try placing a free firearm wanted classified ad.
If you have the time search pawnshops, gun shops and especially gun shows (leave your name and phone number with the shops, some shops will not buy percussion guns without willing, ready buyers).
Often there are very good deals at gun shows.
In person you can verify condition and negotiate yourself a good deal at shops and gun shows.
Regarding ebay, quite a few sellers do not know much about what they have. They often don't know the condition... is the bore rusted, pitted or does it have other issues like a bulge or ring, do the lock and triggers work correctly, was the gun built from a kit, etc.
Also, are you o.k. with a mismatched numbered barrel and stock? Seneca's are becoming collectible. If you eventually move on and sell or trade; a mismatched rifle is worth less than a correct one. On ebay someone else may outbid you for the other half of the Seneca.
Senecas do come up for sale here on MLF free classified ads. You could try placing a free firearm wanted classified ad.
If you have the time search pawnshops, gun shops and especially gun shows (leave your name and phone number with the shops, some shops will not buy percussion guns without willing, ready buyers).
Often there are very good deals at gun shows.
In person you can verify condition and negotiate yourself a good deal at shops and gun shows.
don hepler
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Well, I don't know if your scale and calipers are broken or not, but I was a machinist for over 40 years and my Seneca measures .812 which is .062 larger than 3/4 and you stated that you had a Douglas barrel in your rifle and that would still fit a Seneca stock with .032 gap on each side. I put a 15/16 barrel in a Renegade stock, leaving a .032 gap on each side and it really doesn't look that bad. Maybe they changed diameters somewhere along the way, but mine mics. .812.,(not .750). Tape measures are not that accurate, and what type caliper are you refering to? Vernier, dial, or digital?
Rat Trapper
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Rifleman1776 said:Rat Trapper said:
Does that mean my tape measure and calipers are broken?
My Seneca is 12/16" really 3/4".
I have no idea of what you have or what you broke! I do know TC Seneca rifle barrels are 13/16. A number of guys have had barrels made up when they couldn't find some of the hard to get small calibers. Then again maybe on a Monday morning at TC some worker set the machine up wrong and ran a few barrels under size before his head cleared from the week end.
Something is "broke"! :grin:
The biggest problem with Thompson Center guns is the ability of parts interchange. Not to mention the after market that saw an opportunity to make money on interchangeable parts.
It is getting difficult to tell if you have an unmodified gun. :hmm:
The Seneca is a wonderful gun. :thumbsup:
They are getting very expensive and hard to find. The 36 cal is almost impossible to find. It is probably the most desirable version.
I ran into a fellow that had a brand new one (45 cal) still in the factory sealed box. He was asking $1500 for it. :shocked2: I suspect an average shooter is in the $500 range. One issue with them is, these guns are not magnums, and it seems as soon as someone gets one they want to know how heavy a charge they can shoot. :idunno:
They do share parts from the Patriot pistol which is a wonderful gun, too.
hadden west said:
My barrels are Douglas. They both drop in with no problem or slop. For the 'hawken' I still have the original barrel and it measures the same as the Douglas. For the record, both are .45 cal. as is the Seneca.
don hepler
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you right on ebiggs
